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I like the CSM and have been playing them now for about 7 months. I really don'y have a big army: 3 Oblits, a Pred, a Rhino, 8 Zerkers, Khorne Lord on Jug, 2 - 10 man CSM, 5 Possessed, 5 Termies, A Sorcerer Lord, a Defiler, lots of Summon Daemons, 2 Spawn and 2 Daemon Princes. I know, I know, I need more Rhinos. Anyway, I got creamed by the Guard in a 1500 point game today. Our kill points were the same, but I really got creamed. I lost 1/3 of my army by the end of round 2. At the end of round 6, I had 1 Termie, 1 Oblit and a Defiler with both arms ripped off and the Battlecannon wrecked. I didn't realize that Guard had an entire unit that could have melta bombs. Any tips on beating a Guard army? He had two Leman Russ tanks (demolisher + plasmas+ lascannon / battlecannon + 3 heavy Bolters), two Primaris Psykers, heavy weapons teams (2 lascannons + Missile launcher), Mortars (3), Chimera, 4 Rattlings, Heavy weapons team (3 auto cannons), 30 infantry, 10 Veterans w/ Harker, 1 Platoon command squad. His infantry had plasmas, flamers, meltas etc where he could have it.
This is the first time I've really taken a but whipping, so I want to make sure it doesn't happen again.
That's a very gruesome match for us. Even with flawless tactics, you can still lose hard. Having only faced Guard a couple times, I'll leave the advice to other vets.
Side: If you're customizing your list for Guard-kill, then you might consider dropping your champs all told. You don't need the power fists to take out puny guardsmen, and those points can be used to prop up other units in your army, even if you're just adding numbers.
Best of luck. IG is the most competitive army in the game right now.
Last edited by Rabbit; February 15th, 2011 at 16:27.
Spambot kill tally. . .337
I agree. I spent the game saying things like "you have what?", "what's that range again?", "your weapon does what now?" & "do I get armour saves?". I did put together a list to try and do better against them and I may ask people on the "lists" section what they think.
I (with my little gaming knowledge) would suggest lots of daemons, to pitch in to as many infantry units as possible early on, whilst your heavy weapons prioritise their main threats, e.g. tanks etc, after this, then you should be able to turn your army against their basic troops who are without support.
I f you could get hold of one more rhino, one squad of CSMs could have MoK and relly complement your assault (plus being far enough ahead for your daemons to pop from).
adamwelton "Bliss-giver is right as always."
"Opportunities multiply as they are seized."
Probably half of my gaming group plays IG (either as their main, or secondary army), so I've had a lot of bouts with them.
Step 1 - Kill the tanks.
Step 2 - Chase away their troops.
Obviously, that's not always easy. They can take a ton of tanks! But you want your heavies focusing on the biggest threats to your troops (the cannons on LRs of just about every variety), all the while moving up your melta troops (get more Rhinos ...) to finish those off as necessary. DPs can also do the job.
With a Defiler pie-plating their exposed troops to soften them up, you can then move on to those squishy things, and either chase them off with shooting, or charge, and clean up.
It's crucial to make the most of cover, too. Just as you mentioned, 'Do I get an armor save?" gets asked way too frequently against IG. Play it safe as you advance. Stay in those Rhinos you need to buy more of as long as you can, and keep those things behind walls when possible. It's a fight of 'advance or die', but you cant' go about it stupidly.
We just had a few more people start Guard armies, so we have about 5 people with it including the store army which is Guard. I personally have more luck with Daemons against the Guard than my CSM army, albeit the Daemons have trouble killing tanks (highest strength ranged weapon is 8, AP 1 no melta). But that doesn't mean I do well against them. I don't know, it's probably just me, but it seems each new codex is more "over the top" than the next. Look at the difference between the oldest codex (Necrons) and the the Newest (Dark Eldar). Way more stuff, way more things to think about. I'm going to counter the Guard with Oblits, my Pred with lascannons, my Defiler with Lascannons and Chosen with meltas and see if I can't waste a few tanks before they waste me.