Even there bloodthirster is pretty good.. I think the Lord of Change is quite cool too, and the Great Unclean One is very economical and has a goodly ammount of wounds.
The Keeper of secrets strikes me as the most difficult to use, but I do like the model/atmosphere most.
in order of cc power
1 = bloodthirster (obviously)
2 = keeper of secrets
3 = lord of change
4 = the great unclean one
in order of speed
1 = bloodthirster and lord of change
2 = keeper of secrets and great unclean one
in order of resiliance
1 = great unclean one
2 = bloodthirster
3 = the keeeper of secrets and lord of change
also remember that the great unclean one has nurgles rot, slannesh has the best minor phycic powers and that the the lord of change does not have to roll for phycic tests.
How do you figure that a lord of change has less survivability and less combat power than a keeper of secrets.
The LoC has 12" movement, the KoS 6". While the KoS is slogging his way up the field the LoC is just hopping from cover to cover (if he's not already in CC). Beyond that their survivability stats are identical (save, toughness, etc)
The LoC has better weaponskill and initiative, the KoS only has better str and number of attacks.
An LoC is made for killing HQ's while a KoS is more geared towards troop killing.
Well ws 8 and 7 are practically the same thing and make little difference for the most part except against ws 7 or 8 creatures and their aren't many. The LoC has one better initiative but has a little over half the attacks of a Keeper of Secrets, that's why the keeper of secrets is better.
I believe you should decide what army you want to play with and if this army is dedicated to a particular god then go with the greater daemon associated to it. For me the choice came naturally when I choose to have a nurgle based army.
If you wish to play vanilla chaos space marine or Undivided chaos space marines then go with the Bloodthirster, he's one of the best in town for many reason, his CC abilities and the fact that he flies being only 2 of them.
Personnaly I believe that the one for my army is the Great Unclean one. Resilience at its best he's an HQ buster and one unit is tied up in CC with him its only option is death
Well the whole initiative argument is pointeless because as stated on the GW online store about the Keeper of Secrets, " Any model in base to base contact with the Greater Daemon must halve their Weapon Skill and Initiative.".
Originally posted by Venge@Jan 30 2005, 23:28 Well the whole initiative argument is pointeless because as stated on the GW online store about the Keeper of Secrets, " Any model in base to base contact with the Greater Daemon must halve their Weapon Skill and Initiative.".
Originally posted by Fandango@Jan 31 2005, 18:27 THE GREAT UNCLEAN ONE!!!!!!!!!!!! cause hes so great and unclean.
I actually like the bloodthirster more though.
Either post reasons for choosing a demon, such as why they are good / bad, or don;'t post at all...
The reason this "Whats best" thread hasn't closed is because there IS justification behind peoples choices. Tactical advice people, not a popularity contest.
yes but the rule of the KoS with halfing ws and I is for the fantasy rules otherwise it would be stated in the chaos space marines codex. because the KoS hase the same text as the fantsy version get it?
Then we need more info. about your list.
Anyway pointwise the best daemon is Keeper of Secrets imo.
Btw, about the Keeper of Secrets, is daemonic visage + warp sream.
I'm a Nurgle player at heart, so of course I love the big ugly Great Unclean One, even if he does look like an overgrown nurgling.
But in all honesty, I think the Changer of Ways is the coolest model of the lot, but rules wise.. I stick to the GUO (He is awfully sticky) T6 and all those wounds attract a lot of fire, regardless of actual damage potential.
go with Blood thirster, always a good safe bet. Of course im very partial to Khrone and thier style of play, c/c is always way better than Shooting. plus his armour save will help keep him alive, because all daemons are just large bullet magnets. Kinda like the Night Bringer for the necrons, his stats used to bother me until i played against him. Just fill him full of rounds from your fav. heavy weapon and he wont even make it into c/c
Well like I said before it's the great unclean one for me but here are my reasons.
First he's the cheaper of them all, paying 150 pts for what he can do is awesome. Yes he's don't have a great WS and many attacks and he's kind of slow, but you can negate the slow factor by making him possess his vessel within 12" of the target you entend to kill with him. Strengh wise he is average but with a T6 and 6 wounds he's there to stay. Support him with a squad of plague bearers (remember that they are living icons) or plague marines like the one that was accompanying the aspiring champion that acted as a vessel and you can mow throught almost anything.
So point wise he's better than a tooled up Daemon Prince and he's usually cheaper.
My favorite target is enemy HQ's trying to hide in the back of their army, plague marines are quite good as it is, but supported by a great unclean one they are fearful. Take the aspiring champion acting as vessel near the meat shield enemy lines, possess him with the greater daemon, then summon you daemons near him and make them charge the line, then proceed to pass them and attack your target with the great unclean one and the squad of plague marines that accompany him. 2 turns and the game is almost over
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