Welcome to Librarium Online!
Join our community of 80,000+ members and take part in the number one resource for Warhammer and Warhammer 40K discussion!
Registering gives you full access to take part in discussions, upload pictures, contact other members and search everything!
How useful are they anymore?
I mean, statisticly speaking, they aren't too bad for 50 points, letting your foot slogging troops move up an extra 12, pop smoke, try it again....
But are they worth the points cost for that? My main opponent is a nid player and as such a rhino with a rune could mess with his gaunts for a good long while as well as harbouring my marines..and since the gaunts can't touch the rhino, they can be gunned down at will....
The VC is the only real issue, and even then it's only glancing...
What are your thoughts?
As a nid player I typically don't worry about the Rhino because it doesn't scare me. The reason it is worth it though (and I pray my brother doesn't read this) is because you get a chance to dictate who fights where. When you don't have a rhino I run my guys up and pick which of my units is going to assault which of your units so that your terminators can't dont get to my tyrant until the genestealers get to them. However with a rhino you can drive where ever you want (right next to my genestealers) get out, flamer me, combi-flamer me (if you are lame) and then rapid fire, and your terminators are going to get to powerfist the snot out of my tyrant who just can't deal with a whole squad of them like my genestealers who are fallen without even getting into close combat. They are also great for blocking lines of sight; move up to cover, get out and shoot at the unit you would like to kill, making sure that your flank is blocked so your lead unit doesn't get swamped in bolter fire from the aproaching troops, then move it to the other side and you get to rapid fire them as the advance into 18 inches. As a Nid player I would take one...freaken no vehicles, why can't I get a huge beatle the poops gaunts...
Rhino's are highly effective against any army. Reasons listed before blocking line of sight, moving your troops, blocking the flank are all easy to apply with rhino's. Always have 2 squads in rhinos if not more when you CSM looking for getting into hand to hand. Any remember 2 troopers can shoot out of them, vs Nids this should be flamers!!!
40K-Beakies(9-14-4),Guard(4-7-2),Orks(34-12-11). FANTASY-Dwarves(15-6-7),Beasts (14-14-1), Skaven (17-17-10) DoC (6-1-2). CYGNAR (28-15-1)
Plus, sometimes you can do insane things with them. I abused the possessing spirit of one Rhino once by driving striaght for a squad of Guardians. They blew it up of course (my Traitorous Marines had bobbed off before this point to shoot up some Rangers). When it was 3 inches away. Where it proceeded to get a 6 inch blast radius and killed half the Guardian squad.
Gives a great mental image. Like something out of an Arnie movie.
Last edited by Zveroboy; May 3rd, 2005 at 15:33.
- Watch this space.
I like them for all the obvious reason that have been already stated. Line of sight block (moving wall), Tank shock low ld troops, faster movement for basic troops.
I love them for the shooting rush I can do with them, what I mean by that is that I place 4 plasma gunners with a couple other marines inside of it and I drive near an ennemy unit I want to obliterate (work well against terminators), take out your squad and spread some plasma love.
It's only our only flanking option, they stay rather untouched when you put a predator in front of it to take the incoming heavy weapon fire, that way you can get that CC squad behind ennemy lines rather quickly an if you deploy them wisely the rhino can block the line of sight of incoming fire for the turn they cannot chare. All in all it's not bat for 50 pts and I love to have 2 of them in my 2000 pts army.
How did you fit 4 plasma gunners into one rhino? A CSM squad can only have 2 plasma guns, and a rhino can only transport the squad it's attached to -- unless you were using it to transport chosen?
I also don't like using a predator to shield a rhino -- you're sacrificing the firepower of the predator by moving it more than 6", and, even if it is possessed, it is shooting one weapon at a lower BS than normal. If you only move it 6", then you're losing 6" of movement from the rhino, so the troops might as well just be leggin' it themselves.
In my opinion, the best way to use rhinos is to use a lot (which ensures some will make it to the enemy lines), or none at all. This is because they are so easy to destroy (and face it, they are -- sure, they're great against small arms fire, but it just takes 1 average heavy-weapons shot to take it down), one or two are likely to be killed fairly quickly by most armies. If you do use them, though, smoke launchers and extra armor are pretty much required, and any more than that is mostly just a waste. Both allow the vehicle to live longer and do its job better -- it can still move when stunned, and it can pop smoke to hopefully survive another turn. After popping smoke, the only major things you need to worry about are being immobilized and destroyed on the glance -- you don't care if your gun is destroyed, that's not what the rhino is there for. It's there to move the troops. Immobilizing nullifies this purpose, but graciously allows your troops to disembark as normal the next turn. The rhino being destroyed not only nullifies the additional movment, but means your troops will be entangled the next turn (I believe -- unless that's one of the higher destroyed results), which is even worse. Regardless, a rhino is fairly safe after popping smoke.
All of that being said, a rhino is generally fairly reliable for 24" of movement, assuming it has extra armor and smoke launchers, and it pops smoke after its first move. Combine that with a 6" move by the troops and a 6" assault the next turn, they're pretty good for a 36" assault range. I wouldn't trust them for any more than that -- so not incredibly good against static armies who will remain on their side of the table. Additionally, if you don't get the first turn, one or two could be trashed before you even get to move them at all.
I'll admit they have their uses -- but I'm not planning on using them anymore, since, in my view, the drawbacks to them outweigh the benefits.
havoc sqauds which can take 4 heavy / specia wepons or chosen in powerarmour.
Yes, Havoc squads can have 4 plasma's. Since I play Death Guards I'm not allowed to have heavy weaponry and this is the best next thing. It' deadly enought that I would use it in a normal CSM army if I had to choose between that and a dreadnought...
The trick is to place the predator on a flank and to place the rhino 2" behind it to protect it from first turn incoming fire. You are not really sacrificing your predator by doing that, you are just using it as a cover. It's going to be shot at anyway... Make the predator move 5.5" the first turn so it will still be able to fire all its weaponry and speed up with your rhino up to 12". On the second turn the ennemy will have the choice to either target that 50 points rhino that try to flank him (with what's inside of it) and a nice 140 points predator. So far in my case they took the more immediate threat (the predator), so that rhino usually is left alone long enought to deliver it's load... On turn two move your rhino another 11.5", unload your squad and if you are less then 12" away of your target (heavy weapon, tanks or artillery) then you have 8 plasma gun shot to spread, works all the time (even if you can kill your plasma gunner on a 1 or a 2 ). Effective range on turn 2 is 36", more if you started 10" frome the table boarder, At my game store the table have a width of 48" so I'm pretty near anything on the ennemy flank...
That's the way I play it and it generally work rather well, dealing with flankers or flanking the ennemy. If I play a chaos undivided army lead by a Nurgle Lord I can do this twice by putting my 2 Plague Marines squad as Havocs (7 men squads with 4 plasma guns inside rhino's) so they count as Elite Choice and with 2 predator that count for Heavy Support choice. The 2 rhino's are bound to get where they want to go...
Rhino's are really useful for rapid fire weapon squad, and plasma guns are a powerful weapon, if you ally both of them you have a good result. Of course if you put a lone rhino in the middle of the field it will go boom on first turn for sure.
Last edited by Thyr; May 3rd, 2005 at 23:35.