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I am strongly considering starting a thousand sons army and i need some suggestions on how to start out.
Last edited by W@CK!; July 27th, 2005 at 21:01.
i feel pretty, o so pretty! I feel pretty, and happy, and High!
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First off, welcome to the forums.
For a Thousand Sons army, you'll want to start off with a squad or rubric marines (Traitor Marines with the mark of tzeentch that have been reduced to dust inside their armour by Chief Librarian Ahriman) as a stable firebase- these guys can dish out a horrendous amount of firepower, as their slow steady march forwand means they don't count as having moved when they open fire. Some Tzeentch daemons wuld be a good place to begin as well- horrors, or bolter sponges, are great fun, it's just a pity they don't split in two when you killed them like they used to (or still do, I don't like fantasy) in WHFantasy Chaos Hordes.
Once you've got that down a vehicle to take out enemy armour and suchlike- Thousad Sons can't have any weapon other that their bolters, being merely souls trapped inside their armour. Come up against some big nid gribblies or a few railguns and your marines aren't gonna be too happy.
Hope that's helpful, I might also direct you to LordofChange who has written a very thorough tactica on the Thousand Sons, and other TS players will also have their say, I'm just here to get the flashing blue-purple psychic energy ball rolling.
Ah, another convert welcomed to the fold.
One thing i must say to you, before you start, is that i would consider a different army if you are an inexperienced player, or if you are considering thousand sons as a starting army. They are a very complex army to get the hang of, and you will not experience very many victories if you have not had experience with a "vanilla" army first. But then again, if you like a challenge, and don't mind losing a lot, go for it.
As monsieurcartier has said, thousand son squads are great - always take at least two of them in an army of 750-1500 points. Coupled with a squad of horrors, they can lay down an awful lot of gunfire.
Give aspiring champions bolt of change and thrall wizards - this will add a tank or monstrous creature busting element to an already powerful squad.
Stick with a lord for your HQ except in high-point games, make room for more sons. Make him medium powerful in both close combat and psychic prowess, to fill the CC requirement that thousand sons don't do so well.
As for heavy support, i always find a mutated predator with all lascannons works best - it's hard to kill so gets the job done, and adds that extra punch to the army that can be combined with the bolts of change to make a massive heavy weapon firebase.
I will add more to this post tomorrow, im being ranted at to get off the computer :p
But for now - good luck, nice to see another guy interested in the sons.
All is dust!
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Besides re-statin the purchase advice already given (which I agree with) you can find cool fluff in Index Astartes and the Horus Heresy books. :cool:
For a good HQ I'd stick with a Lord on a disk. He's fast enough to get into combat quickly and he won't be shot at if you know what you're doing. He's not a monster killer, but he can carve through troops like nothing else. I'd stay away from a Tzeentch Daemon Prince because you won't have the points that other armies do to trick him out with goodies. A Lord of Change is another good option, but I dislike that I have to use an Aspiring Champion for the luxury.
Chosen are generally agreed upon as being too expensive for what you get. It's nice having a squad of 9 Terminators all with Bolts of Change, but in the end 500 points is a little much to pay for those models. Possessed are slightly better off, but they will be 37 points each if you give them talons, and they still don't have any psychic powers.
Rubric Terminators (upgraded Thousand Sons) are generally considered a better option. It's hard to peel these guys off the table what with a 2+/5+ save and 2 wounds. Though I wouldn't have a large squad of them. 5-6 is probably enough.
Thousand Sons have really made me fear the raw power of bolter fire. It's scary how much firepower a Thousand Sons unit can lay down, and scarier how much they can take in return. Have at least two squads of these in a 1500 point list.
I have always found Horrors to be awfully sub-standard. As someone said here, they are considered to be bolter food. I like my army to have as much bang for its buck as possible, so I strongly suggest a sqaud of Flamers to you. Flamers are obscenely good at wiping out any unit. If you point a squad of Flamers at anything (except terminators) that squad will not be there after that turn. Just choose them well. They're not needed against Imperial Guard of Dark Eldar, as their save can be negated by bolter fire.
If Screamers weren't AU$16 each for a 16 point model I would probably have more of an opinion on them. Considering I'm not so rich as to have been able to use them, I have no advice to give.
You need Heavy support in your army to make up for your awful lack of heavy weapons available to your troops. So, you will probably need two heavy support slots at 1500 points filled and all three at 2000 points. One of each works well enough for me. I have a Dreadnaught with a Lascannon, a Predator with three Lascannons (picking up a vibe?) and a Defiler with a Battle Cannon. Any mix is pretty good, but I wouldn't take more than one Defiler as you have strong enough anti-troop abilities anyway.
Beasts of Chaos (4000)
Chaos Marines (3000)
I agree with most of Tones comments. I love my 1K Sons and really after playing them four of five times you will get the hang of them.
I never use Chosen ( unless they allow me to play Ahriman's Chosen which are great fun)
Smaller lists i use a Lord with medium power and for bigger games I use a Prince with Speed and Flight and Mutation and Dark Blade.
I try to fit a Rhino in for a squad that has a little more speed and they also make for good cover. I'm not a fan of Preds but I often take a LR for a squad as well - you will hear a lot of dissention here as some feel LRs are overpriced but I am not of that opinion.
Flamers are great but I will generally go with a squad that is five Horrors / four Flamers to save a few points.
Just a comment on Rubric Termies - you will hate them. They are very expensive and personally I find a squads of 1K Sons armed with bolters better options.
As for Heavy support - I always take one Defiler and one Dread - remember I use an LR as well. This seems to fit the bill quite well.
Sons are slow - be aware of that at all times. Do not be afraid to move backwards and fire. This is primarily a shooty army. Do not make the mistake though of thinking that Sons cannot go H2H - they are marines with two wounds apiece. Just don't run them at Genestealers or large Ork mobs :rolleyes:
Having said that, I wouldn't underestimate Thousand Sons in combat. They may only get one attack each, but they have two wounds a piece and they are Marines, with Marine stats. Quite often I'm placed within 12" of an assault squad far out from the rest of the army. I move further into rapid fire range and whittle them down. In the state they are now they can still do damage on the charge, and a well-timed counter-charge can be all that is needed to finish off such units. An AC with a power weapon or powerfist is still doing a lot of damage. And with the amount you will outnumber them by it is worth it.
Beasts of Chaos (4000)
Chaos Marines (3000)
Thanks to everyone!
I followed most of your advice and am playing the first game with my sons on August 4
Which units are you planning on using?Originally Posted by W@CK!
Hey LoC, where can I find your TS Tactica