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Kai Gun & Ether Lance

2K views 20 replies 10 participants last post by  TwoHats 
#1 ·
I see plenty of people using Dark Blade & Dreadaxe, but does anyone ever use the Kai Gun or Ether Lance?
 
#2 ·
Oneiros said:
I see plenty of people using Dark Blade & Dreadaxe, but does anyone ever use the Kai Gun or Ether Lance?
The Kai Gun is popular in shooty armies, often the Iron Warriors. I don't use it personally since I much rather have a counter-charge unit with a Dark Blade for those armies, but it works for some people. It's a good weapon, and is excellent for taking out MEQs.

The Ether Lance on the other hand is a poor choice. Wind of Chaos is much better than the template attack. Wind of Chaos + Power weapon is only ten more points than the Lance, and it doesn't eat up a third of your Daemonic Gifts potential.

For more on this subject, see this thread -

Click Me

I wrote it quite awhile back, but I stand by every last thing I say in it.
 
#3 · (Edited)
A not very appropriate story.

My friend modeled up a Chaos IC with a Ether lance a couple years back for a tournament.

Unfortunately he went out his way to make the most physically imposing weapon that he could to represent it and not enough care on choosing exactly the pose of the model.


Imagine a giant traffic cone covered in rotating blades and chainsaw bits held at just under waist level, the tip of the cone shaped whirlygig pointed straight ahead, again at just under waist level. (No I have no idea why he picked this shape.)

It was particularly disturbing if he happend to charge a model facing the other way.


Suffice it to say this model was referred to by my friends opponents as carrying the 'dildo of doom' at the tournament he took it to, and hasn't been seen on the table since.

Its a shame really.

This model has to be seen to be believed. I should get a picture.

As to its game value for him, I have no idea. He was too pissed off about the comments on the figure he had lavished so much attention on, so we never got a rundown.
 
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#4 · (Edited)
lol, Caluin you have a habit of answering questions to thoroughly and destryoing any chance of a good flaming session.:rolleyes: If anyone else on these forums answered first they would have said something like Kai Guns are exlcusive to Iron Warriors and ether lances plain suck. That would have started a good debate.:)

Ps: I would also like to disagree with 2 things on your daemonic gifts thread. 1st, 4+ is a huge advantage for a daemon prince with a dreadaxe as it allows him to go toe to toe with your enemies big things (I.e carnifex's, Wraithlords) where he previously couldn't do that.

Also daemonic fire can be very useful for a lord with lightning claws (or if they have talons/ venom for some reason).
 
#5 ·
LordLink said:
lol, Caluin you have a habit of answering questions to thoroughly and destryoing any chance of a good flaming session.:rolleyes: If anyone else on these forums answered first they would have said something like Kai Guns are exlcusive to Iron Warriors and ether lances plain suck. That would have started a good debate.:)
Heh, just part of my job, I think. But there is no reason for people to not debate - I only stated my opinions on the two weapons. People are free to disagree.

LordLink said:
Ps: I would also like to disagree with 2 things on your daemonic gifts thread. 1st, 4+ is a huge advantage for a daemon prince with a dreadaxe as it allows him to go toe to toe with your enemies big things (I.e carnifex's, Wraithlords) where he previously couldn't do that.
As is your right to disagree - makes for differing opinions and good discussions. Though, I still think a Darkblade would work better against the Carnifex and Wraithlords. A Statured Prince with a Dark Blade easily hits strength 8. Enough to wound a Carnifex on a 2+ or 3+, and a Wraithlord on a 3+. And, as I've said time and time again - the Daemon Prince is not designed for taking on big creatures such as that. They're troop killers. A Carnifex with Toxin Sacs and any Wraithlord will kill the Daemon Prince in one hit. You just can't put him into danger like that.

LordLink said:
Also daemonic fire can be very useful for a lord with lightning claws (or if they have talons/ venom for some reason).
So would a Bolt Pistol, which is not only cheaper, but doesn't eat away at his Gifts total.

As for Talons/Venom... what the 'ell are you doing putting either of those onto a Lord? Possessed Champion, perhaps. But a Lord?
 
#7 ·
LordLink said:
Off topic I know but I was under the understanding that a pair of lightning claws took up both your weapons slots?
They're listed under the "Two handed Weapons" section of the Chaos Armoury, so they count as a single two handed weapon. Any character model may have up to two weapons from the armoury, one of which may be two handed.
 
#9 ·
LordLink said:
Off topic I know but I was under the understanding that a pair of lightning claws took up both your weapons slots?
I had a huge rant with someone who was adamant that this was the case. He then realised he was reading the wrong codex. A pair of LCs is a 2-handed weapon, letting you have a single handed one as well as the 2 Lcs, just as Caluin says.

Kai guns are great fun, and not just for ICs. Try giving your havoc AC one, giving the rest of the squad plasma guns and putting them in a rhino. They can all shoot twice as they get out of the transport...... I'm sure you can guess what your opponents expression will be like :D
Ether Lances are OK for marines, but they are overlooked, mainly because people have a tendancy to write on their army lists 'daemon weapon' and pay the cost for how much a dark blade/dreadaxe, and inform their opponent what it is at the start of the game depending on what they are playing. Cheeky and low, yes, but it happens.

Also, Caluin, I thought the wraithlord was S8? Not enough to Instant kill a DP.
 
#11 ·
IAmAngel said:
This is enough to instant kill a DP unless it has toughness a toughness enhancement for example D. Stature.
What, you mean the d.stature from being a daemon prince in the first place?
You need s10 to instant kill a DP. Which a wraithlord does not have.
 
#12 ·
monsieurcartier said:
I had a huge rant with someone who was adamant that this was the case. He then realised he was reading the wrong codex. A pair of LCs is a 2-handed weapon, letting you have a single handed one as well as the 2 Lcs, just as Caluin says.
This is only the case in the CSM codex as all others I have seen list Lightning Claws as single one-handed weapons. If this was an oversight or a specific benefit of CSM is unknown so until there's a FAQ stating otherwise, enjoy it.
 
#13 · (Edited)
monsieurcartier said:
What, you mean the d.stature from being a daemon prince in the first place?
You need s10 to instant kill a DP. Which a wraithlord does not have.
Um. Wraithlords have a modified strength of ten. It carries two Dreadnought Close Combat weapons which raise its strength.

Its Toughness is a 8, which is perhaps where you're getting confused.

Pg. 15 of the Eldar Codex.

This is kind of off topic of the original thread though.

EDIT: I meant that discussing the Wraithlord is off topic. But since we're allowed...
Kinda makes me wonder why they bother listing it with a base and a modified strength since you can't blow the DCCWs off the Wraithlord. I guess there might be a few things out there that effect things on their unmodified strength.
 
#14 ·
LordCreampuff said:
This is only the case in the CSM codex as all others I have seen list Lightning Claws as single one-handed weapons. If this was an oversight or a specific benefit of CSM is unknown so until there's a FAQ stating otherwise, enjoy it.
That is correct - it is something peculiar to Chaos. Space Marines have it listed in the single handed with the misnomer "Counts as two weapons." Just a little thing that Chaos can enjoy and hold over their Loyalist brethren.

Grey said:
Um. Wraithlords have a modified strength of ten. It carries two Dreadnought Close Combat weapons which raise its strength.

Its Toughness is a 8, which is perhaps where you're getting confused.
That's correct. Had to look it up to make sure, since I don't play against Eldar too often (read: never).

Grey said:
This is kind of off topic of the original thread though.
Meh. It's not harming anything, people are learning new things and new tactics, and the OP is learning why people choose Darkblade and Dreadaxe over the Kai Gun/Ether Lance, which is concurrent with his post.
 
#15 ·
Grey said:
EDIT: I meant that discussing the Wraithlord is off topic. But since we're allowed...
Kinda makes me wonder why they bother listing it with a base and a modified strength since you can't blow the DCCWs off the Wraithlord. I guess there might be a few things out there that effect things on their unmodified strength.
The Necron Monolith comes to mind as one unit that doesn't allow augmented strength due to power weapons, power fists, DCCWs, etc...
 
#16 ·
On the note of Daemon Venom..

I used a Daemon Prince for a while with Stature and Venom. It only cost me 100 points for a flying one. Bombed a couple of Wraithlords with that combo; a frequent (very) opponent of mine exclusively plays Iyanden. It was very effective, and very cheap. Just make sure you add Mutation or Spiky Bits, and always get the charge. :D

Otherwise I'd have to say the Ether Lance and Winds of Chaos are similar. Both require LD tests, hurtful flames, etc. I used an Ether Lance for a while. I'd have to say:

Only use the Ether Lance for fluff.

For effectiveness, it's not the best choice; however, I found it quite characterful.
 
#19 ·
LordLink said:
even using a glaive for fluff is irrelevant. Daemon weapons can be modeled however you want so you can just make a Dark Blade-Glaive or something. I myself am making a dreadaxe spear.
That's not what I meant.. sorry for not clarifying. Rather, using the Ether Lance characterizes your Lord. It makes him different from other characters because he wields that weapon. The way the weapon is represented on the model is irrelevant.

I'm interested in this Dreadspear... :D Got any pictures?
 
#20 ·
My bad about the wraithlord. Nobody's perfect :D

I don't see anything wrong with the ether lance; it has a fairly decent ranged attack that's almost as good as WoC and throws a power weapon into the mix for pretty much the same cost. Sure, you'll take Ld/Mastery tests more often as you can't kill things in combat with Wind, but the ether lance isn't a bad weapon. Plus it's single-handed so you can get +1 attack for a ccw and still have a decent shooting attack.
 
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