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You all know that heavy bolters are very good against horde armies (HEQ, T3, 4+ or 5+ save). But what about MEQ (T4, 3+)?
Some MathHammer:As you can see, that extra shot of heavy bolter against MEQs is better than one less pip to wound. And of course, against HEQ heavy bolters work like electric mincers.Code:shots MEQ kills HEQ kills 4x MEQ 4x HEQ h.bolter 3 0.444444 1.666667 1.777778 6.666667 a.cannon 2 0.370370 1.111111 1.481481 4.444444 plasma.g 2 1.111111 1.111111 4.444444 4.444444 4x means 4 Havocs firing.
I've added rapidfiring plasmaguns into the table. At close range they are THE weapon against MEQ, but assault cannons will get that extra turn or two of shots. Even h.bolters get quite close to our overheating guns.
Yes, 4xAC with TH means a lot of vehicles destroyed, but how often do you see so many vehicles in a game under 1250 points that your lascannon teams can't pop them? Only when they are low-armored, like these DE skimmers. And heavy bolters work just fine against them too.
My (perfectly debatable) recommendation: in low point games heavy bolters are better than autocannons.
Last edited by onodera; November 15th, 2006 at 19:29. Reason: table layout is screwed... still
The maths says yes.. but my experience says no.
wounding on 3+ isn't enough. Not against meqs or stealers. Between the range and low strength, the extra shot doesn't cut it against MEq or higher toughness beasties.
Against GEqs, of course, taking heavy bolters is a sound tactical move.
One thing which isn't accounted for in the above maths is tough units which aren't vehicles. T6 and plus units. Not everything is a vehicle or Meq/Geq.
Against a carni would you rather be wounding on 3+ or 5+?
Sorry, I don't mean to wee on any parade of your onodera, as usual, you've done fantastic work, just that i see the extra Str of the mighty autocannon as usefull against any and all targets with a rate of fire that still gets the job done.
You don't have to believe me or my Excel macro I've written (I don’t, I'm still testing it), but against T5 creatures autocannon is just marginally better than heavy bolter, 0.37 kills per gun versus 0.33.
At T6 the difference is 33%, noticeable, yes, but you've saved enough points to get a lascannon or a couple of meltas in your troop squad.
Only at T7 is the AC twice as better as heavy bolters, but are there that many T7 creatures in the game?
The points aspect is of course a really good point.
I'll admit, i've never tried using 4 heavy bolters in a havoc squad.. but everytime i've tried to use heavy bolters with my obliterators, i've regreted it.
Maybe i should try them......
MEqs - Marine Equivelants (T4, Sv3+)
GEqs - Guard Equivelants (T3, SV4/5+)
HEqs - Hoard Equiv (T3, SV5/6+)
Everything I have told you, even this, is a lie.
Hey, they have lascannons and twin-linked plasma and melta guns as well. Little h.bolters must be bullied somewhere inside an oblit's body by all these weapons that all outperform them against MEQs.Originally Posted by Karmoon
Warhammer isnt a math game, most of things work in theory but when you do it, it will probly not work.