Defensive Gun Line - Can It Work? - Warhammer 40K Fantasy
 

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  1. #1
    Junior Member tangomegadeath's Avatar
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    Defensive Gun Line - Can It Work?

    Hi all,

    just a quick question...and apologies if this seems stupid, I haven't played in a LONG while.

    Is it possible to make a defensive gun line work for SMs? (1500pts).

    The reason I ask is that I have started making a pre-heresy Salamander force and I can't decide on a list for it.
    This has become a stumbling block for me as I can't continue building until I know what to build!!!!!!
    I love the new devestators but don't know how they could fit in to different forces.

    I've looked at loads of setups for Marines - such as drop Pod, termie, mechanised, all infantry and now gun line.

    Any and all advice regarding the best way of going about building a list, and pros and cons for the unit types would be very, very, very appreciated.

    Thanks in advance for your time.

    MEGAdeath.


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  3. #2
    Set Sail and Conquer! Cadaver Junkie's Avatar
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    I'd like to say, that from an IG and marine player's point of view, you CAN make a marine defensive gun line, only the problem is, there are other armies out there that can do it much better.

    Like IG.

    And Tau.

    You'll probably just end up getting outshot in situations like that. I personally feel that marines work best as a good mix - a bit of gun line, a bit of assault, and then a personal touch, ie: terminators or vehicles or whatever.

    Just my personal experiance/view.
    "Pickles, the drummer, doodily doo. (Ding-dong, doodily, doodily, doo.)"

    Also, you should google "garfield minus garfield". Awesome.

  4. #3
    Junior Member tangomegadeath's Avatar
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    Yeh you're probably right, maybe I should use a dev squad or 2 as an anchor for a flank and attack from it?

    Any thoughts about the other type armies mentioned?

  5. #4
    That Which Has No Time Red Archer's Avatar
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    I have used defensive gun line lists to great effect.
    Of course there are opponents like stationary Tau and thelike who are much easier to beat if you come at them. But 2 devastator squads, a lot of (maybe 3-4) 6-(or5-)man heavy weapon troops can deal quite an amount of firepower. Be sure though to have some countercharge units (at least 2 or 3 at 1,500 points) and then maybe take in a squad of terminators with assault cannons for more firepower.
    Against most opponents you should be very fine. Some that are able to outshoot you will be tougher. But of course, this makes for a whole lot of gaming fun. It's still possible to win, only makes it harder!

    (I wouldn't play a tournament list like this, though. If you forfeit the option of swapping your devastator from missile launchers to bolters or the lascannons in your tactical squads to plasma cannons then it will be very hard to be successful against a large variety of different opponents.)

  6. #5
    Art Culinaire BLADERUNNER's Avatar
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    If you like the gun wielding lunacy idea. I tend to take up dreadnaughts as my fire support, along with the
    prime choice the whirl wind.

    I.E. Dreadnaught with Las Cannon, and ML

    Bulk up on these and build your army around it.
    -HONORABLE MENTIONS IN BLITZKRIEG PAINTING COMP-
    "THAT I.G. GUY WITH THAT OVERDEVELOPED TRIGGER FINGER"

  7. #6
    Member ServanoTomasin's Avatar
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    I've done it numerous times with my IH, to various degrees of success.

    With the right men and equipment, its quite easy and fun, so long as you don't depend on too many heavy infantry carried heavy weapons and your enemy doesn't either (heavy) artiellery or fast (possibly jump pack) infantry.

    Like I said, I use Iron Hands, so my commander usually has 2-4 heavy weapons with him, although it can be better to have my techie with an command squad. If you don't have a techmarine as a commander, use one in elites - cheap heavy bolters or multi-meltas, give him a razorback, and you have more fire power. Command squads are good to put heavy weapons in, unless you want them to be combat nuts.

    In tactical squads have heavy weapons like missiles - dual purpose weapons, have some with heavybolters and some with lascannons. If you want close range support, use plasmas or melters.

    Devestator squads, equip with what you may think is best. Normaly I have a mix of las and bolters. For tanks, I use razorback support and dreadnoughts. Anypoints left over, I use on landraiders.

    At small numbers, like 750, gun lines work. Upwards, they aren't as good, and you'll need a semi-move-able gun line. After 1500, non-moving infantry with moving tank support will work well.

    However, guard are alot better at the gun line, marines are all rounders, so have some assault units.
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  8. #7
    Ghost of LO ForgedInTheFurnaceOfWar's Avatar
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    Just select honor your wargear as a trait. Ditch the salamanders if you want a gun line - they are more about special weapons. Anyway, honour your wargear will allow you to field up to 6 dev squads. Thats probably the best gun line around.

    Peace
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  9. #8
    Set Sail and Conquer! Cadaver Junkie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ForgedInTheFurnaceOfWar View Post
    Anyway, honour your wargear will allow you to field up to 6 dev squads. Thats probably the best gun line around.

    Peace
    It would look impressive, granted. Only problem is, thats like 450 points for 5 man minimum squads, without any heavy weapons! Double that, or more, if you actually do want them to have anything other than boltguns.

    As an example of why this is a problem, for the same 450 points, an IG army can already have, what, 4 heavy bolter teams (giving 12 heavy bolters total) and another team with 3 lascannons. Then there's the 30 guardsmen carrying the weapons.
    When you begin to equip heavy weapons on your devestators, IG can just up the anti as well.

    I've always felt that marines are best when you can use your superior skill set to close the majority of your army on an equal numbers or less portion of the oponents force. Full army vs full army in a static line, I rarely see a battle go in the marine's favour. (Unless its marines vs marines )


    marines are all rounders, so have some assault units.
    Words of wisdom. Yeah, I subscribe to the no 'all eggs in one basket' approach
    "Pickles, the drummer, doodily doo. (Ding-dong, doodily, doodily, doo.)"

    Also, you should google "garfield minus garfield". Awesome.

  10. #9
    Senior Member SimulatedSnowman's Avatar
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    As was stated previously, it probably could work, but that's only because marines are so good at everything. If you limit yourself to just one facet of their strength such as a gunline, you make a line full of really big well-armored guardsmen, without the numbers and big guns that guardsmen can bring. I suppose some of it will depend on the mission and the game. For instance if you and a friend have your gunline SM army and a CC type army, you chould have your pal keep everyone off you. Chances are if you get your shooting turns without having to worry about your firepower being drastically limited by a couple of fast CC units, you'll come out on top. However that's a pretty specific situation and probably not that common.

    If you did set up a SM gunline, Whirlwinds are fun and deepstriking some termies along with it is better. Imagine a Imperial fist gunline with some Lysanderwing action in it. It's damn near cheesy.
    Last edited by SimulatedSnowman; October 12th, 2007 at 01:49.
    I think you need to spend more time on your floor.

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  11. #10
    Senior Member DominionWeaponsGroup's Avatar
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    The space marine gun line is actually very effective. A couple 8-man devastator squads with 4 missile launchers (preferably with tank hunter), 6 6-man tac squads with lascannons and plasma guns, and a couple speeders or whirlwind will do pretty well. Your advantage over guard armies is how much harder it is to kill a marine than it is to kill a guardsman and a better BS. Not to mention the fact that your bolters are worthwhile and lasguns basically aren't.
    Take life seriously, its lethal.

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