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Besides the eldar Tyranids are the only race I'm realy quite afraid of. I have only played them 3 times (never with my guard) and lost horribly (one time I did not kill 1 single model, course this was in my first month of the game) So I don't realy know what to expect. And although they are not too common I want to know how to kill them. The 2 things taht realy seem scary are 1 the first turn combat potential units, or the ones who will duck behind cover not giving you aline of sight untill its too late. And the canrnifexs for their sheer resiliance and the fact that once there in combat there not getting out.
The only solution I have to those problems are.
-Deploy far back into your deployment zone
-Infiltrate a squad and throw them in a spot where genestealers might show up, or at least try.
-50 conscripts and guant. Just because a Carnifex is not going to be doing too much once he gets into that.
Any ways It would be interesting to start a thread on how to kill 'nids, any and all forms of them using any means. Please and Thank you
Last edited by s0m3w0n; January 2nd, 2008 at 22:24. Reason: Mis clicked submit, and I wasnt done.
-This probably isn't that effective. With their low initiative and saves you're probably just throwing away another squad that could instead boost your gunline.
-True, but this leaves a nice big mass of meat for gaunts and stuff to attack.
For gaunts, genestealers, etc:
-Ordnance templates are nice. It lets you take out large chunks at a time.
-Heavy bolters are also good for finishing off units with only a few members left
-I've found that hellhounds work pretty well. They're also effective against warriors, raveners, etc.
-Also, you should finish off units. With some armies you can usually ignore units once theres only a few left, but with Nids its a good idea to annihilate each unit. This is because they can move quickly and possibly tie up your squads, losing you another shooting round and blocking line of sight.
For big Nids like Tyrants and Carnifexes, you'll want high strength, low AP weapons like plasma and lascannons. Ordnance works as well, but their priority should be the swarms first, then monstrous creatures later.
Usually, its best to target Tyrants first because with wings, they can move pretty quickly. While Carnifexes can be dangerous, you can usually afford to ignore those for a turn or two while you focus on the fast creatures.
When it come to other units like Warriors, etc., heavy bolters and autocannons are a good choice.
For Lictors, I suggest filling up any terrain pieces that your units will be using.
IMO, you should avoid taking flamers. Because of the long movement and charge range of gaunts, you're unlikely to fire off a shot before they charge.
If you can, killing synapse creatures can be helpful
When placing terrain, its a good idea to make places for your people to hide in, but if you know you're facing Lictors, don't put so much that you leave a lot of places for them to appear.
Also when you're done placing terrain for your army, put the other terrain in the back of the Nid player's deployment zone where its relatively useless for them. Don't place it in the middle of the table where it can block your line of sight.
There is no such thing as a plea for innocence in my court. A plea for innocence is guilty of wasting my time. Guilty.
- Inquisitor Lord Fyodor Karamazov
qsd has very good advice. I would suggest taking as many heavy bolters as you can and some lascannons. Try not to move into your enemy, but keep a distance so you can hammer away at him with your heavy bolters.
For the monstrous creatures, don't ignore them, but don't waste shots on them. Lasguns wont do much, nor will heavy bolters. Save the multiple shot weapons for the swarms and warriors.
Save whatever tanks you can to take out the swarms first, especially the ordinance ones. They will tear apart your guardsmen faster than the monstrous creatures will. Use the pie plate whenever you can, and keep all of your squads and tanks cheap.
Also don't rule out mortars. The ability to lay down a barrage of 3 templates means you can cover a lot of models - especially if, as often happens, the nids are all bunched up in a big swarm. Just target somewhere in the centre of it so even if you do scatter badly your going to hit something.
Keep your lines over 6" apart too - that way when that unit if hormogaunts with 30+ attacks eats your guardsmen they are left standing in the open with a lot of angry flashlights pointing at them.
And as has already been said, shoot one unit until you completely destroy it before moving on.
Dovie'andi se tovya sagain (It's time to roll the dice)- Mattrim Cauthon
How far can each unit move in 1 turn (inluding their charge) ? I dont mean the maximum I mean what most players will do.
Homagaunts and Raveners have 6" movement, fleet and 12" charge (19"-24" charge).
Gaunts have 6", fleet and 6" (13"-18")
Gargoyles have 12", fleet and 6" (19"-24")
Genestealers have 6", fleet and 6" (13"-18"). They lose fleet if they have a broodlord wiht them.
All monstrous creatures have 6" and 6" (12") unless they have wings (Tyrant and Warriors only) where they move 12" and charge 6" (18") or Leaping (Warriors only) where they move 6" and charge 12" (18").
An important thing to remember when facing nids is to keep fire discipline.
Shoot units in this order (IMO).
1- Synapse Creatures that can be killed in one turn and will leave other units synapse free.
2- Any unit in charge range (usually it is a better idea to simply move the unit that will be charged by them out of charge range if possible) of something important.
3- Opportunistic shots. Shooting clumped units with a pie plate or mortar for example. Or shooting a tyrant who's tyrant guard are out of line of sight due to a well placed chimera.
3- Homaguants/Gargoyles/Raveners (unless they are very far away)
4- Flyrants, Flying Warriors and Leaping Warriors (unless they are very far away)
5- Things that can shoot your tanks and deal heavy damage (only if you have tanks)
6- Things that can shoot important squads and deal heavy damage(command squads, heavy weapons squads etc.).
7- Anything else.
You should also use split deployment if the terrain suits it.
Here is a nice like to a split deployment article by Cheredanine.
http://www.librarium-online.com/foru...ad.php?t=92866 (Split deployment - The Art of Firepower)
I must admit, I never let my infiltrators go for anything as small as a genestealer unless they are the only things in range. Against nids, I will say that veterans are many times better than stormtroopers for the amount of firepower they can take along.
*If you are playing a zilla list, than you already know the layout. 2 tyrants, 6-8 fexes, 8-16 ripers and 30 or so hormies. You infiltrators are the key to success. Before the battle even starts, you can have them deploy close enough to take 4 shots at the tyrant, 3 plasma and a lascannon. If you have two vet units, you pretty much kill half of his synapse before the battle even starts by killing the tyrant, if you have three units than you have a chance to kill his entire synapse network on turn one. Alternatively you can stick the infiltrators on the sides of the field where they will draw one of the big guys, and some small bugs at them, thus making each vet unit a perfect diversion. Its the only unit in our army tat has a chance to kill any MC within a single turn of shooting.
*On the other hand, if you are facing a swarm list, vets are still an option but they will die the 1st turn since the little weasels move 6", fleet, and charge 12". So you should probably just let them come to you, since you cant stop 100 bugs on the 1st turn. Here though, conscripts are an amazing tool since they can block a large volume of the little weasels and provide you will a fair blockade for about 2-3 turns, which would allow you to thin their numbers and take some shots at the big things. In a case like this, needless to say, you definitely need to be making out with your board edge during deployment.
*Genestealer armies, in my personal opinion are the easiest to beat. They are lead by a broodlord and the entire army usualy donesnt consist of more than 60-70 models. These models are T4 with a 6+/4+ save so guard usualy dont have any problems stopping them.
*The toughest force however, or probably the most unpredictable is a mixed nid army when you dont know what you will be facing. So you would probably want to generalize things to the best of your extend. Take a 40-50 man conscript unit with gaunt, a vet unit or 2, a lots of infantry with HBs. This can vary from person toperson since you never know if you will have a lictor coming at you, or a biovore shelling you from afar so you have to do your best to compensate for both things. A hellhound is kind of a variable in many cases, yes its amazing when shooting things like genestealers but you have to be careful of the big things as well as too many little bigs because some can be outfited to target Av10 so the tank isnt completely immortal after all.
There is a way to negate the incredible speed of nids. Use a couple of squads as sacrifices. Place them about 7 inches in front of your line. The nids will assault, win, and consolodate right in front of your army. You can do this several times, and just keep rapid-firing until they are all dead.
"When one man dies it is a tragedy. When thousands die its a statistic."
Okay, I play both Guard and Tyranids (which means I have never played AGAINST either but we can ignore that...)
Choose your targets, I know this sounds stupid but really, choose them well. Disregard synapse for the first few turns - kill his raveners hormagaunts and anything with wings. Including that winged tyrant with the Twin-Linked devourers which many tyranid players go moist over....with good reason, I know that goes against ignore the synapse for now but you REALLY want to kill that bugger, it has 12 good BS decent S shots rerolling to hit AND to wound? Kill it.
Right, once the really fast stuff is dead move on to the merely fast. Genestealers and Gaunts, infiltrating broodlord and retinue if he has them, but ONLY if the broodlord infiltrated and is thus scarily close to your lines. Nail any remaining synapse at this point as long as there are not things getting too close to your lines, in fact, get the synapse before turning on the gaunts, but kill stealers before that. you do NOT want a brood of genestealers getting into CC, ever.
Then taget his slow and probably shooty stuff, carnifexes. If he has close combat fexes IGNORE THEM, they are slow with a capital SLOW.
Now, your selection. Heavy bolters are your friend, their AP is low enough to bugger up any non monsterous creatures on the board. Lascannons for the big ones, preferably 2 AT squads at the back of your army. Tyranid shooting tends to be short ranged so you dont need to worry about losing them to ranged firepower until his Carnifexes have killed your tanks, and since the Venom Cannon cant penetrate armour a few leman russes might help here, pie plates are fun.
The name refers to facial hair, not playing style.Originally Posted by A news vendor's stand, London, June 1940
Run in Fear...?
I would try and not set up on the edge of your deployment zone. Other then that, Heavy Bolters.
Thats what I hate when playing Guard.
Army's used: Space Wolves, Tomb Kings, High Elves, Tyranids, Tau and Eldar.