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Where should i start?

1K views 31 replies 9 participants last post by  Commisarlestat 
#1 ·
i am a fantasy player with an empire army, but i wanted to start a guard armr because the two are quite similar. But i am not shore where to strart, can u help?
 
#2 ·
Well, do you like to use vehicles? taking armor is nice with guard cause that means its less models to paint, or do you like the idea that a horde of regular schmucks can take on giant fearless bugs, undying metal skeletons, or the fallen children of the Emperor? A good place to start is to buy the codex first, and the battleforce is a pretty good deal. I would read over some IG battle reports and get a feel for their playstyle.
 
#3 ·
Amishcellphone speaks truly. Your first purchase should be the codex, then I'd recommend spending some time browsing around here to get the hang of things. As stated before the Cadian Battleforce is a great purchase for your money, and there should be a topic about maximizing its contents by Triumphofman or Bobahat IIRC.
 
#4 · (Edited)
First of all, Great Choice! The IG are a great army to play. Heads up, people like to talk a lot of crap about IG because they are normal people with normal weapons and everyone else is used to being super human fearless magical psychics that are really fast. Hey, we can't all be cool kids. This is also fine because if you study up a little and read some of the great posts on this site and other sites (mostly this site) you will create an extremely tough army that is also lots of fun to play with and against. They can be a little more complicated than some other armies but when you play them right you will devastate your opponents. If you play them wrong though you will loose every single time. One of the authors of a tactics post on this site who's name I can't remember said "No army gives you as much rope to hang yourself with."

You can't go wrong buying an IG battle box. It's a pretty good one. I am still building up to a full 1850 pts. I have over 1000 now that is mostly built from 2 of said box sets and I might buy a third one. Get the codex obviously and then before you go buy a bunch of stuff you don't want later, read some of the tactics posts on this site because IG have a lot of options.
 
#5 ·
as stated many times before me but the codex first and then get a battle force, or if you want to make and armored company, get the rules off the website, and i would recommend getting the Leman Russ Squadron, which comes with 3 Leman Russes for the same price as the battle force, and you can convert them into whatever you want.
 
#6 ·
The Imperial Army Design Tutorial is a nice post to check out. There are other more advanced tacticas and tutorials that are great to read but I really think this one conveys the message and will help you to know if IG is what you are looking for.

Be careful with that armored column. I heard that it was no longer legal in tournaments. (maybe that's just for colonists?) They still look cool for fun games or a 3000 pt apocalyptic game or something like that. I might build one later just for fun games and apocalypse but not till I build a tournament legal army. If you really are a tread head, and can't get enough with a normal list, go mechanized.
 
#7 ·
There is some good advice already given. I would point you to the stickied threads, both the one written by Forger and the one I wrote.

Having a list to start with is important as I'm sure you knwo from Fantasy. After reading around the site post up a simple list say 1000 points and let people rip it apart if necessary. Label it as your first list and you should do fine.

Don't buy anything apart form the codex until you have this list sorted. Then refer to the thread I wrote which shows how to build a simple effective list wihtout wasting money.

Hope that helps

A
 
#11 ·
For a defensive army you are going to want mainly troops that are backed up by heavy hitters. A good list will go for a platoon or two and some bassies. Other units to consider are rough riders to protect your lines form assault and russes as they are good anchors to a force. Command squads set up for leadership will help this setup but voxes shouldn't be needed. Possibly go for cameleoline as a doctrine to get some good cover saves.

Perhaps if you posted up your empire list we could try and create an analogy for each unit in the guard list. A little bit on your tactics with each unit would help as well.

Hope that helps

A
 
#12 · (Edited)
this is my 2k empire list that works.

lord:general of the empire tactic: stay in unit of swordsmen making them immune to fear.
armour of met. iron(1+ armour save)
icon of magnus(immune to fear)
sword of justice(reroll all failed to wound rolls)

hero:captain of the empire tactic: take out artillery enplacments
full plate (4+ armour save)
shield
barded warhorse
lance

hero:warrior priest tactic: stay in unit of spears meaning 10 rerollabe attacks.
heavy armour
extra hand weapon
shroud of magnus(5+ ward save + magic resistance 2)

hero:(lv2) wizard tactic: stay in the unit of hand gunners and blast the enemy to hell
dispel scroll
wizards staff(+1 dice to cast with)

hero:(lv1)wizard tactic: hunt down the enemy leader and slaughter him
speculum(switches ws, bs, t, a and i)

core:20 swordsmen tactic: hold a rigid line of defence with spears and flaggies
full command
detachments:10 halberds + 5 free company

core:20spears tactic: hold a rigid line of defensive with swords and flaggies
ful command
detachments:10 xbows + 5 free company

core:20 flaggellants tactic: hold!!
champ.

core:10 huntsmen tactic: infiltrate and stop the enemy marching.

core:1o handgunners tactic: fire!!
marksmen w/ long rifle

special:6 inner circle knights Tactic: counter charge
full command

special:5 pistoliers Tactic: haris enemy troops from flank
full command

special: great cannon tactic: Ka-boom

rare: hellblaster tactic: ka-boom, ka-boom
 
#13 ·
Ok well to start in a guard army Giving you officers alot of wargear is usually a bad idea.

Since You want to go with a gunline, your officers are going to be large leadership bubbles. This meens that they will be behind your troops so its harder to be hit.
I would recommend your lead officer be a HSO (the highest leadership officer) and give his squad the commpany banner (rerolling failed leadership 10 rolls is amazing) Then give one of your platoon commanders the honorifica imperialis (this gives him the stat line of an HSO for a few points less)

Doing this will give you 2 strong leadership bubbles, I cant really say what you want to do with weapons special and heavy weapons for the officer's squad (gunline is not my first choice of guard) so can someone more experienced help out with that?


Now for your actual gunline squads, alot of damage comes from the heavy and special weapons. You want these to weapons to complement each other (a flamer and a lascannon are a bad choice) I perfer a plasma gun and a missile launcher in every one of my line squads. This combo gives them a very strong hitting power, and even some 1st and maybe 2nd turn tank kills.

Just a heads up, flamers are vary rarely used in imperial guard and in most games you will be lucky to get a shot with one. also in your gunline squads, you dont want to use a melta gun either, as an immobile squad, it just has to short of range
 
#15 · (Edited)
Aha right lets get substituting:

The general:
A good analogy for this is the main HQ command funnily enough. As you use yor empire general to boost your squads effectiveness as far as leadership goes then the following should work:

JO with Honorifica, and iron discipline, mortar (it's a fairlyu standard squad but works wel)

The first hero:
This is akin to drop troops in guard armies. droppingin to take out those pesky long range shooters. Perhaps the following could fit the same role:

5 x vets, inc sarge and three meltas. Drop troops. (as most long range shooters in 40k tend to be tanks then dropping in meltas is useful to fill the same role)

Warrior priest:
The priests in a guard army do a similar thing but they arent as useful as this. they need to go in the command squads first so careful planning of an army to use them is essential. A priest with eviscratr is a good setup in a guard army.

The last two heroes:
These guys dont really have an analogy in 40k. psykers are pretty poo. So perhaps compare these guys to your platoon commands? alternatively vets with a single heavy weapon. Think of using something long ranged to replace these guys, options include heavy wepaons teams heavy weapon toting vet squads and heavy weapon toting commands, a bassie could also fill this role.

Core troops:
The tactics with these guys seems to be stay back and counter the enemy. This means platoons are a good analogy. (25 men as well!). If you went strictly this way the a (sorry got distracted biiiiig bolt of lightning sounded like a bassie opening up 8X ) where was I. ah yes the platoon commands could stand in for the attachments you have so on eplatoon cammand with several special weapons and the other as CC counters. normal platoons can work with pretty much all of the weapons in different combos but some are better than others will be able to say more when you write your list.


The cavalry:
Again simple enough these compare to rough riders, one with lances and possibly one with special wepaons could work (as a comparative to pistollers) alternatively the carapace doctrine for rough riders only could be interesting for you, some 40k knights as it were.

The cannons:
well the first cannon could comapre to a russ and the second to an exterminator. Simply put these guys want to be Russes with triple heavy bolter setup.


Overall for a list go for soem platoons with a good leadership base, use some russ and fire support squads to bulk out the firepower and get some rough riders for countercharge.

Hope that helps

A

PS: Dcotrinesare all found at the back of the codex. Effectively they are magic banners in effect. ie. you choose what you want and place it on the squad and they gain effects. Dont take too many and be careful who can and can't take them as well as who has to take them. For your type of list:

Iron discipline: pretty much a staple for me, this aids your leadership when given to officers.
COD: a fun doctrien and also free it means if you get bunched you can gain advantages
Drop troops: this is for dropping squads like the vet squad described above in behind the enemy again free
Rough riders: for counterattack
Carapace for rough riders: expensive but not that bad a buy, this version is for rough riders only
Veterans: gives access to more veteran squads which can be very useful.
 
#17 ·
Start with the battleforce or just a box of cadians. The battleforce is great value especially if you use the russ but a box of cadians will help you to get at your colour scheme and get into buildinga nd possibly converting some IG.

Might I suggest you write a guard list before purchasing anything it will mean you wont waste money.

Also another tip, the empire sprues have lots of feathers and such like knocking around, mixing these into your guard is always good for a bit of added character. I have used both empire and brettonian bits in my guard armies and it does look good.

I would also refer you to the stickied article I wrote about purchasing, there is also another article up there which has a lot of useful advice.

Hope that helps

A
 
#20 · (Edited)
Yes that is one of the good combos Il give a run down of the best:

Anti MEQ:
heavy bolter, plasma.
This is the most points effective combo for killing marines and such like but the missile launcher isnt very far behind at all, the missile is more versatile so...

Missile, plasma.
The best overall combo agianst MEQ armies, it gives a good all round performance and is a good buy for the points.

Anti tank:
AV 14 is a lascannon, dont put any special wepaosn with this it just reduces effectiveness and costs more points
AV 13 the lascannonis still the best bet here and also for the points
AV 12 and below is where you need missiles and autocannons mix these with plasma and you have very good anti tank squads
AV 11 the autocannon beats the missile launcher
AV 10 the autocannon wins hands down, the missile and hevay bolter are pretty much equal at this level of armour

Interestingly the multilas is extremely good for its points at these lower levels of armour so chimer and sentinel anti transport is always a good idea.

Anti infantry:
Against guard and such like the heavy bolter wins out again and by a large margin. As for a special weapon the grenade laucnehr really wins out as well especially if you are going to get 3 or more by the templat (It still works if there is only two under the template.)

AN overall combo for an all comers list is the missile grenade combo, the ability to fire the frag and the krak is indespensible. If you are goign to face majority MEq then plasma is probably the better special weapon but the missile grenade combo is by far the most versatile.

Hope that helps

A

PS: purple as a colour schee can be used in a few ways.
Firstly as a parade style jaket with cream trousers (could look good with black armour)
Secondly as part of an urban camo sheme oreven an ash waste scheme.
Thirdly it could be used as an accent colour. Uniform edging (see link to freehand in my sig) or it could be used for should pads or even simplya patch for the army symbol, for example the divisional patch on my units is a small purple square with a white shied in it.
 
#22 ·
Good command squads depend on the army you are using. the basic main command is JO with HI and mortar. Iron discipline and a banner are sometimes thrown in here as well. If it is leadership you want then hiding them out of the way with mortars is always good, if it is support then a single heavy weapon such as an autocannon is good. If you want countercharge then priests and commisars can beef up the squad. powerswords and close order make a good platoon countercharge unit.
They are also good with multiple special weapons such as triple flamers or such like. Drop them in or use them to threatening closing assault troops.

As for drop troop conversions many people dont really bother. The elysians from forgeworld have lots of funky drop kit. All I have done for mine is give them berets so they stnad out as the vets. It all depends on the effect you wan to acheive really..

hope that helps

A
 
#24 ·
welllll

Stormies get 1 less special weapon but have better armour. They also cost a lot more as a squad when they deepstrike (thats 3 points per guy IIRC) in the end its a choice between a five man squad with 2 plasma and a five man with 3 plasmas. As they are goingto die in short order the vets are effectivlety the better option.

This is all down to list and play style though. Personally I prefer modelling vets so that wins out for me but stormies can work just as well.

hope that helps

A
 
#26 ·
i want to max out the battle force and a cadian box set and a chimera(i have no idea whatt to buy). but i have a large problem with the heavy and special weapons(i can't choose). i know you wrote an article but can you help me? i have no idea what i will fight so i cannot say.
 
#27 ·
i want to max out the battle force and a cadian box set and a chimera(i have no idea whatt to buy). but i have a large problem with the heavy and special weapons(i can't choose). i know you wrote an article but can you help me? i have no idea what i will fight so i cannot say.
 
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