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so I was browsing through my codex. in light of the things I've learned from playing 5th ed, and in the light of playing DH for a bit, knowing the GK heroes aren't IC's when they have a retinue. now that the CC rules are different than in 4th ed.
so I checked, and the WH Cannoness sure enough has the same wording as a GK GM... as long as she's got a retinue, she's not an IC, and niether is a priest...
the gears in my head got to turning, and I thought how rude a squad with a lot of flamers and 3 buried eviscerators would be. death to big HQ units. Especially when you put a Litanies of faith with them to auto SotM for the Invul saves on the charge, or on getting a charge.
In the end, I went with something like this:
Cannoness - Book,Blessed Weapon, cloak, Litanies, Brazier of Holy Fire.
Priest - Eviscerator, Power Armor, Brazier of Holy fire
Vet Superior, Eviscerator, Brazier of Holy fire
7 Celestians Hflamer, flamer, 5bolters
Rhino w/extra armor, smoke
I'm content with the unit, but I think it might be able to be a bit better. of course, you could drop the cloak to make it cheaper, or drop braziers to make it cheaper. admittedly, I've NEVER taken Braziers of Holy fire before. I'm not a fan of one-shot weapons. but 5 flame templates with DG on the charge is devastating. heck, even using them for defensive purposes is mean.
then they're backed up with the Blessed Weapon to go at Init, and 2 Eviscerators to hit hard. The preist gives re-rolls to hit on the charge.
I did really enjoy the fact that all 3 hard hitting CC weapons were buried in 3+ armor. I know a unit with a lot of basic attacks will eat the retinue, but they did munch a Dread, a tac squad, and a few Drop pods in the game I tried them out in.
I thought I'd see if you guys had any thoughts on using retinues now. It's just hard to break my love of the jumpy cannoness! but I guess rather than her being a lone ranger that's mean by herself in CC, now she's bringing mean friends too.
By my math, that unit weighs in at like 445 pts. That is A LOT. If you can rock it then I say go for it, but I very much so doubt that it will ever gain it's points back in most situations and against most competent opponents that you will face. I personally think that the squad is trying to do too much. I prefer more stramlined squads that have a spefic purpose that will just get the job done that I created it for.
..aaaaaa, seems too much for a squad of T3 models in a Rhino, no?
it is a bit pricey, but not too out of line with the big, badass HQ's people have been coming out with for 5th ed. (Abaddon or Fabius Bile w/ chaos Termies, Warboss on bike w/PK Biker Nobs, Lysader w/Termies, Chapter Masters w/ Chaplian and Honor Guard, or Vanguard)
I was thinking of what SoB could to that would mutilate a big HQ. TheoryHammer.
My usual reply to big units is 2 Exorcists, but cover saves can hamper that.
sure 2 Squads of SoB's can do the trick with Divine Guidance, and possibly the Jumpy Cannoness to charge in for cleanup, to prevent a counter-charge. But with that, you're again looking at 500+ points to deal with a big threat unit. You're also possibly jeapordizing your scoring units.
Of course, I'd LOVE to be able to put this unit into a Land Raider Crusader, rather than a Rhino.
I wanted the rhino to protect the unit from getting shot up.
I'd thought the Rhino could get them to an area of the board they could exploit, then get out and flame down an expensive unit, preferably from inside cover, then move and charge after that. 7 high Str Power weapon attacks are mean. even if the retinue gets charged. 10 that re-roll misses is really mean if they don't charge you.
i'm trying out something that seems a bit counter-intuitive. It might not be worth it.
ok...with a Landraider you are dropping 695 (700+ with upgrades) on one unit and as SmokWawelski stated...they are T3 models. know that there are a lot of people who do play with overly expensive HQ choices like C'tans and so for, but the matter of the fact is that a C'tan is not going to get wiped out with one vindicator pie plate shot. A C'tan is on;y 300 pt vs the 445 or 700 you have and or want at this time. If you want an expensive HQ choice I would choose to go with the living saint or Mr walkie-pants. As cool as landraiders are I very rarely see them make past turn three as people tend to freak out and do what ever they can to take it out. A 700 point unit and transport may be cool for a apocolypse game. I have yet to see an SoB apoc force.
I love the idea, in a rhino though, maybe instead of taking out the braziers, you should give the flamer sisters bolters. I say this because it gives you more expendable models before you start to lose your big weapons, and since it's so mean in CC you'll probably only get one chance to use the flamers anyways, either because the enemy shot you to death, or because you charged. And you'll save a bit of points.
I myself play DH and always field a 404 point HQ unit. Gotta love GK psychic hoods versus eldar and tyranid armies...
Last edited by Ready4anything; December 13th, 2008 at 05:30.