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I played back in the 90's with 3rd Edition. I had an Ultramarines army with various and sundry allied units(Adeptus Arbites, Assassins, Inquisitor, etc).
My army is mostly in another state though I'll have access to the remainder in March when I'd like to get around to playing again. I've bought the Space Marines Codex but not up to all the new rules yet. I'll be playing at a local Games Workshop with whoever is around(probably middle schoolers).
So, the old quota system for having at least 25% squads and less than 50% support or characters system seems to be out the window in favor of some strange new thing with HQ, Elite, and Troop type units. Or something. Does that really change things too much? Can Librarians command armies now or what? It's all a bit unclear.
Here's a rough outline of the units I have. Some are probably missing some arms and others are probably lost...but without spending too much there should be the makings of a decent force here. Decently fun anyway.
Two Full Tactical squads(the plastic ones that came with the 3rd edition box.
One modified sergeant with power fist and chain sword. I think there are two rocket launchers and two flamers.
Half a devastator squad. Not assembled. I think there's a couple of heavy bolters and a lascannon maybe. I can swap those in for the rocket launchers that come with the tactical squad.
At least one terminator squad. Maybe 3 with chainfists or powerfists and stormbolters, one with an assault cannon and one other with lightning claws or thunder hammer and storm shield? I don't remember.
A terminator Chaplain
The old Marneus Calgar in power armor model.
A generic Captain with power sword and plasma pistol.
Maybe an apothecary? Maybe the special Ultramarines ancient?
Predator with lascannon sponson mount and autocannon in turret.
A random Space Marine with a wrench riding a bike with a wrench for some reason. I guess I could convert it to have someone else's upper torso.
A super old Inquisitor in terminator armor.
An Eversor, Callidus, and Vindicare assassin(I think those are the names, at any rate the skull face berzerker guy, the polymorth girl, and the sniper guy).
A small squad of 5 bolter armed Adeptus Arbites plus a sergeant with a shotgun(apparently).
I understand that having allied assassins is more difficult now than before(you need an Inquisitor as an Allied HQ to have the Allied Elite assassin?). So they're probably out.
I'll eventually pick up a rulebook but for now I'd just like a quick rundown from someone who played 3rd edition who can tell me relevant changes and give a little advice.
I started collecting in third, but not playing seriously, but I hope I can help out somewhat.
first of all, there's a bigger difference between 2nd and 3rd than 5th and 3rd id argue, so most things are kind of the same. you'll get a long way with your knowledge of 3rd edition.
What has changed as you've already mentioned is the introduction of the Force Chart, each army has to include one HQ and 2 Troops Choices, apart from that you can pick whatever you want. (within the boundaries of the FOC)
What I would start with when you get the rulebook is to read through the scenarios as I'm sure they've changed somewhat, as well as reading up on the special rules, but also the way hand to hand combat works. In 5th the biggest difference from the previous edition is that troops are the only units able to hold objectives, other units are only able to contest.
Now if I would build a force out of what you have there the tacticals are automatically in since they're the only troops you have, I hope you have another sergeant though, and that you can exchange this sergeants chainsword for a bolt pistol. I would also put the Heavy Bolters in these squads if you decide to take the devastator squad.
Also the terminators, this is a complete squad if not for the LC/TH+SS guy, maybe this is a power sword guy? then the squad would be complete.
predator would be a better loadout with heavy bolter sponsons
devastator squad LC+ML are fine combination, but with half a squad (5 men?) they will start losing heavy weapons soon, you need to improve man-count here and add a few marines to soak up some fire.
lastly i think i would go with the terminator librarian for HQ, but thats a minor detail up to your playing style.
What I would recommend when you start collecting/playing again is to add some mobility to your force, either in the form of an Assault squad, Bike Squad, Rhino's or other transport for your Troops. Also if it wasnt for your devastator squad youd be quite lacking in anti-tank but its still very stationary so I would perhaps think of some mobile anti tank (attack bikes/land speeders/different special weapons for tacticals)
Anyway, you have a start there and I really hope you can field a lot of your older models, but unfortunately some of them are either bad choices or just phased out units (like the adeptus)
apart from all this, welcome to LO, i hope i have been of SOME help at least
That sounds like a good start. Tacticals with missile and flamer are order of the day now (because they're free ), powerfists are handy too.
Devastators would do well with the full 10 men, otherwise you'll run into problems with wound allocation (if the enemy does enough wounds you could lose your expensive heavy weapons early on).
Terminators are all or nothing now, so you've either got all powerfist and storm bolter (with options for chainfists and heavy weapons) or all lightning claws or thunder hammer and storm shield.
I think you've got HQs covered
You can include an Assassin if you take an Inquisitor Lord, all you need is the Daemonhunter or Witch Hunter Codex. They are a fun choice and I'd take one if I had the model.
There aren't any Arbites, but you can field them as Scouts or Storm Troops from the relevant Inquisition book.
The biggest changes from 3rd to 5th are missions, scoring, and combat. In 5th, you've got 3 missions and 3 ways to deploy. The missions are about grabbing objectives (3-5 in one, 2 in the other) or killing the enemy (each unit is worth 1 Kill Point, the player with the most wins). Only Troops are scoring now, so your Terminators cannot hold an objective, only contest it.
Combat is a lot different now. Combat is fought by units instead of individual models, so you cannot pick out the Sergeant's powerfist before he even gets to strike. Characters are the exception as they count as a separate unit in combat. Models in BtB or within 2" of a friendly model in BtB can fight to full effect and the winner is determined by kills alone. The loser has to test their Ld, reduced by the amount they lost by, and sweeping advance has been replaced with checking I and adding a D6. If the winner rolls equal to or higher than the loser's total the loser is totally wiped out (unless they're Space Marines or fearless), otherwise they get to retreat. It changes the game big time, moving away from uber characters and putting more emphasis on your units.
Other than that everything is mostly the same. The Elite, HQ, Troops, etc thing is your Force Organization chart and it's how you select your army. 1 HQ and 2 Troops is required, and you can add up to 1 more HQ, 3 Elites, 4 more Troops, 3 Fast Attack, and 3 Heavy Support. Your characters are all HQs, Terminators are Elites, Tactical Squads are Troops, and Devastators are Heavy Support.
Any other questions pop up, feel free to ask or PM.
First, a little research reveals I actually played 2nd edition not 3rd. I sure feel sorry for you guys who have bought 3 editions worth of boxes since the changes between 2nd and 5th on a glance of the rulebook don't seem THAT drastic.
Well, since I don't think I was actually going to get any of my old models for two months and I have a week off(plus girlfriend not out of state) I really wanted to get something ready to play in the local GW escalation league thing. So the next one is 750 points and the following week 1000. Not really sure what the deal with it is. I bought Assault on Black Reach for the rule book mainly but since I immediately had the chance to swap the Orks for extra Space Marines I now have a decent force. As a result, what I can field pretty much immediately(need to buy extra large bases for my old terminators) is:
Two basic dreadnought(Multi melta + close combat thing).
Two full Tac squads with chainsword armed sergeants, flamers, and missile launchers.
Two Termie Sergeants(power swords), the 8 plastic termies with power fist and stormbolters, plus two extra oldschool metal ones likewise armed and a final termie with chainfist and stormbolter. Sadly my assault cannon armed termie is not around. If I could get one in a blister I might but I don't know if those even exist anymore. So essentially I have 13 fairly standard termies.
My HQ is where I have the most choice, since I brought those here to paint and left most of my squads at home. What I have on hand:
Three friggin captains in power armor(the two black reach ones with bolter and power sword plus the oldschool one with plasma pistol and power sword.
Marneus Calgar in power armor.
Terminator Librarian with a missing right arm. I could probably use the right arm off one of the plastic terminators. I'd rather wait since I'd have to shave down some metal to get it to work and I probably have the proper arm in a box somewhere. Plus this would mean one less regular terminator I could field.
I don't know what I'll fight but I figure it'll be more tanks than I'm used to from the old days. Also probably orks and space marines given the influence of the Black Reach box.
My tentative list for 750 points
Two Tac Squads(Flamers and Missile Launchers)
Termie Squad(sergeant+3 with powerfist/stormbolter+1 with chainfist/stormbolter)
I have some spare points so maybe I'll spend some money and swap the chainfist for an assault cannon or cyclone.
I'll just add another terminator squad for the 1000 point match if the 750 point one is any fun.
I figure the tactical squads will be sufficiently numerous to take objectives and hold them against average troops. I know they'll be torn to shreds by genestealers or banshees but I think my 16 bolters, 6 stormbolters and the pair of flamers should whittle most troop units down. In the olden days multimeltas were great at killing tanks or large critters so I figure my two dreadnoughts should have an even shot at killing their monstrous counterparts. My Terminator Chaplain will probably join my terminators and I think I'll keep them in between the tactical squads to either aid whichever tac squad is looking desperate or let the tac squads tie up whoever is clobbering them while the terminators press on towards any key unit being screened by the enemy's close combat force(like a Psyker or whatever).
That looks like a solid start, plenty of hitty with good amounts of firepower too.
"I would listen to Sokhar. The man's a genius. Listen."~Lord Yossanrion"Thanks, Sokhar. There was some legitimately good advice in between the low-grade profanity, blaspheming and veiled insults."~Quick"Well thought, intelligently put, with a hint of sarcastic bastard!"~Diggum's Hammer
Armybuilder with latest files (for the new marine codex) puts this list at 885 pts. Thats with no upgrades on the two standard dreads.
I know many people hate army builder, but I find it to be accurate, and quick.
but yes, the list you posted is a little over (135 pts to be exact)
Ah I see where I went wrong. I forgot that the new codex has basic tactical squads as 5 models rather than 10. Crazy new world we live in.
So do I just go with one full tactical squad and two dreadnoughts, or do I take one full tactical squad, or on full tac squad and another partial one and no dreadnoughts?
I think my best bet is just one full tactical squad, two dreadnoughts, and add a sixth terminator with my spare points(would have to drop the chainfist).
Arrrrgh. What happened to the good old days of 25%+ for squads. Very well I can go with a second small tac squad of 5 and cut a dreadnought or something. Siiigh.