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Why doesnt the space marines use traits anymore??
THIS IS POOPY
Please mind your language. Cursing in posts is against forum rules -- Canew
Last edited by Canew; March 1st, 2009 at 15:23.
Please read the forum rules before posting things like this.
"It takes a vast amount of self control to be this dangerous."
---Ogvai Ogvai Helmshrot, Jarl of Tra, VI Legion Astartes
swearing is against the forum rules but chapter tactics are better than traits anyway.
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Assuming the forum problems with your post are cleaned up, what are your particular problems with the end of the trait system? I can understand how some players who build armies around a particular trait or set of traits might be upset with the new book. For instance, did you build and paint an entire army with bolt pistols and chainswords? That could be pretty rough.
First off, please take note of my comment and edit in your post.
Now, to the point: The elimination of traits is the latest in a sign of GW trying to streamline army-specific rules that have become cumbersome and confusing for opponents/other players. Now, we can debate back and forth over whether they actually WERE that confusing, but that's for another thread. Point being, GW thought it was a problem that needed to be fixed. If we consider a lot of Eldar-specific rules being changed to reflect the rulebook's generic "Universal Special Rules" in their newest codex and the elimination of legion-specific rules when the new Chaos codex came out, we could have spotted this one coming. If it makes you feel any better, it looks like the new IG codex coming out in May will not have doctrines, either.
Now, before you commit hari-kiri over this, I'd suggest, if you haven't already, reading the new Space Marine codex closely. While there are, in fact, no more traits, there are many, many new character and unit-specific rules and equipment sets that now make many traits unnecessary. Want an all-biker army? No problem. Just lead the army with a commander on a bike. Presto! Bikers count as troops. Look it up. It's true. Ditto for assault marines, if you're hankering for a death from above army, etc. Miss cleanse and purify? Look over the tactical squad equipment allowances and I think you'll be pleasantly surprised. In fact, I think you'll find most of the "popular" traits from the previous codex are provided for in the new codex.
If you find your favorite trait isn't covered any more, why not start a new thread here talking about it? Maybe some of your fellow battle brothers here have found a way to accommodate.
While I think the original post was a bit of an attempt at trolling, I have to say that you are misinformed Canew.
The bikes as troops are correct. The Cleanse and Purify (my favorite trait) is gone forever, not sure what options you're referring to, but there is no way to take 2 special weapons in a squad anymore. As for Assault marines as troops by taking an assault marine commander, please check again, no such rules (unless you're to take blood angels).
I agree with your basic point: current Marines are nearly able to do all of the old traits. However, several of your specific points are just dead wrong. Also, I feel sorry for the people with apothecary squad leaders (Purity Above All) or bolt pistol close combat tacticals (Take the Fight to Them). GW got rid of some of the useful/interesting traits while still allowing the 6 Dread army that I heard loads of people complain about in 4th ed, as well as tying some of the army changes to special characters. Thus, I also agree with the original poster in a way.
I'm trying to catalog every song with a reference to yetis or Sasquatch. Please help.
Yeah, fair enough, you got me on a couple of those. The point being, they didn't just throw out the traits. There are SOME allowances in the new codex. You're right -- some are gone forever, but some aren't.
I abused cleanse and purify but now with all the new stuff SM have I'm not having any problems with the new dex. Plus the stronger ATSKNF/Chapter Tactics combo is GREAT for my army.
What's that, moral check time? I'll just fail and make a tactical withdrawal so you can't assault me. My turn and oh look I re-grouped and can still shoot you with my plamsa-cannon, lol. Couldn't do that with 4th ed ATSKNF.
Also, to keep a somewhat "cleanse and purify" feel to my troops, I'm toying around with the idea of giving some of my tactical squad sergeants combi-weapons.
AND also all those extra marines with special weapons I have with no tactical squad to call home have made some interesting Command squads for my Captains (3 or 4 melta guns or plasma guns + apothacary in a rhino/drop pod HOORAY! FNP for gets hot, woot!).
Plus the new dex is way more user friendly, much better for new players who usualy start with space marines.