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  1. #1
    Lasgun Cell Cook BoxANT's Avatar
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    The role of infantry.

    HWS are a liability. Low leadership, only 3 models who get insta killed w/ S6 weapons, and still expensive.

    In addition, there are better options.


    HB HWS, for 10 points less you can get a Chimera w/ a HS. It kicks about around the same mass of fire, is mobile, can protect weaker squads (psykers, command, ect), can screen other vehicles (arty), and can help you grab objectives.

    Vendetta. For 25pts more than a LC HWS you get a fast skimmer, 3 TL LC (that don't need an order that will fail almost 1/2 the time), can scout and hit side armor on turn one, can transport troops, can make last turn objective grabs.

    Hydra. For the same price as an AC HWS you get a 72" ranged autocannon, it rips apart skimmers, is reliable against Nob bikers, can move and shoot (half strength). It does take up a heavy slot though.



    So is there a reason to take HWS? Can we make due with infantry squads only?

    What is the role of infantry?

    1. Supply scoring units
    2. Protect value units (tanks, command, ect) from assault/melta.
    3. Provide a safe platform for expensive weapons (BiD!)
    4. Provide anti infantry firepower in the form of massed lasgun fire (FRFSRF!)

    Basically we need our infantry to shoot, move, die, when needed. And the basic infantry squad does all these things rather well. HWS simply provide another scoring platform for HW, but they're fragile and low leadership.

    So my question is, can IG move to a formation that doesn't rely on HWS? Can we get our lascannons from Vendettas, our massed anti infantry firepower from our chimeras, and use our infantry squads as a "do it all" AC/GL (or AC/PG) unit?


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    The only HW squad I'm going to use are autocannons. Primarily because I own heavy weapon teams but not hydras, and I can't spare the heavy support slot.

    They're dangerous, but not dangerous enough for people to really focus on them. Though once they realize they're more fragile they might focus on them more.


    Edit: Actually I may use a mortar squad too. Cheap and good for camping the home objective.

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    Listen...

    Missile Launchers dudes...

    Either
    A St 8 Ap 3 Krak Missile (For takin out Space Marines, Vehicals and Monstrous Creatures)
    or
    A St 4 Ap 6 Frag Missile (For takin out Infantry ex. Ork Boyz, Hormagaunts/Gaunts...)

    Only 20 pts in this current 'dex and down to 15 pts in the new 'dex.

    Don't leave home without 'em guys...
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    Senior Officer Corvin - 666th Cadian Defence Force

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    Lasgun Cell Cook BoxANT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DreadEnds View Post
    Missile Launchers dudes...

    Either
    A St 8 Ap 3 Krak Missile (For takin out Space Marines, Vehicals and Monstrous Creatures)
    or
    A St 4 Ap 6 Frag Missile (For takin out Infantry ex. Ork Boyz, Hormagaunts/Gaunts...)

    Only 20 pts in this current 'dex and down to 15 pts in the new 'dex.

    Don't leave home without 'em guys...
    No thanks

    For the price of two ML HWS, i can get a AC HWS and a LC HWS.

    LC is far superior at taking out heavy armor (and MC)

    the AC is superior at taking out light armor.

    Same goes for Infantry Squads.

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    Lascannon squads?

    Don't take this the wrong way, dude... but how many games have you used Lascannon squads in? Even if you do get really lucky with your 4s to hit and do more hits that misses and onto of that don't roll any 1s and end up killing all the big guys with their 2+ saves... then what? You have 30 screaming Orks or Nidz coming at you and all you can do is roll 1 shot and Instant Death 1. Atleast with Missile Launchers you can switch to frags and start killing infantry after you've brought down the big guys...

    Ontop of that they cost the same points as AutoCannons which are only AP 4. which is pathetic... Only 2 shots and Ap 4? you'd be lucky to kill 1 Space Marine.

    I have 15 Heavy Weapons Teams in my army and have tried more or less every combination possible.

    Missile Lauchers are by far the best.

    Trust Me.
    "GOD DAMN THEM ORKS" -
    Senior Officer Corvin - 666th Cadian Defence Force

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    Quote Originally Posted by DreadEnds View Post
    Lascannon squads?

    Don't take this the wrong way, dude... but how many games have you used Lascannon squads in? Even if you do get really lucky with your 4s to hit and do more hits that misses and onto of that don't roll any 1s and end up killing all the big guys with their 2+ saves... then what? You have 30 screaming Orks or Nidz coming at you and all you can do is roll 1 shot and Instant Death 1. Atleast with Missile Launchers you can switch to frags and start killing infantry after you've brought down the big guys...

    Ontop of that they cost the same points as AutoCannons which are only AP 4. which is pathetic... Only 2 shots and Ap 4? you'd be lucky to kill 1 Space Marine.

    I have 15 Heavy Weapons Teams in my army and have tried more or less every combination possible.

    Missile Lauchers are by far the best.

    Trust Me.
    Well, in my defense, I have some experience as well

    If i'm relying on AC to kill MEQ, then I'm doing something wrong. AC are cheap, and effective against most targets, in addition, they excel at taking out Rhinos (better than a ML).

    IG does not need flexibility, we can take enough squads and guns to field weapons that are ment for certain tasks.

    Lascannons are just plain superior to ML at taking out MC and armor, and with BiD! they are even more reliable.


    In addition, if you really love frag missiles, why not take mortars? They cost 10 points less, have the option to fire indirect, and cause pinning.

    However, if you are relying on frag missiles or mortars to take down mobs of Orks, again, doing something wrong

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    Quote Originally Posted by DreadEnds View Post
    Lascannon squads?

    Don't take this the wrong way, dude... but how many games have you used Lascannon squads in? Even if you do get really lucky with your 4s to hit and do more hits that misses and onto of that don't roll any 1s and end up killing all the big guys with their 2+ saves... then what? You have 30 screaming Orks or Nidz coming at you and all you can do is roll 1 shot and Instant Death 1. Atleast with Missile Launchers you can switch to frags and start killing infantry after you've brought down the big guys...

    Ontop of that they cost the same points as AutoCannons which are only AP 4. which is pathetic... Only 2 shots and Ap 4? you'd be lucky to kill 1 Space Marine.

    I have 15 Heavy Weapons Teams in my army and have tried more or less every combination possible.

    Missile Lauchers are by far the best.

    Trust Me.
    You're going by the old codex. Autocannons got cheaper, they cost the same as heavy bolters know. Mortars are the cheapest, heavy bolters/autocannons are five points more expensive, missile launchers five more expensive than HBs/ACs, and lascannons 5 more than ML's. Missile launchers got overpriced and underperform.
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    You're going by the old codex. Autocannons got cheaper, they cost the same as heavy bolters know. Mortars are the cheapest, heavy bolters/autocannons are five points more expensive, missile launchers five more expensive than HBs/ACs, and lascannons 5 more than ML's. Missile launchers got overpriced and underperform
    Well yes, dude. We have to go by the old 'dex because until the 2nd of May that's all we have to go with unfortunately...

    this "old" 'dex won't become the old 'dex until the new 'dex comes out I'm afraid...

    And as for Missile Launchers "underachieving" Games Workshops own resident IG player Andy Hoare swears by him... and he wrote the IG codex so I think I'll go with his opinion im afraid.

    Also who said anything about relying on the Frags to take out the Orks? I use them as long range surpressants. for example today... I used 12 Missile Launchers in my army and made a squad of 20 (or so) Shoota Boyz flee the table in turn 1 and thats with the Big Meks Kustom Force Field giving them a 5 plus save to something that would normally have caused Instand Death.
    "GOD DAMN THEM ORKS" -
    Senior Officer Corvin - 666th Cadian Defence Force

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    Quote Originally Posted by DreadEnds View Post
    Well yes, dude. We have to go by the old 'dex because until the 2nd of May that's all we have to go with unfortunately...

    this "old" 'dex won't become the old 'dex until the new 'dex comes out I'm afraid...

    And as for Missile Launchers "underachieving" Games Workshops own resident IG player Andy Hoare swears by him... and he wrote the IG codex so I think I'll go with his opinion im afraid.

    Also who said anything about relying on the Frags to take out the Orks? I use them as long range surpressants. for example today... I used 12 Missile Launchers in my army and made a squad of 20 (or so) Shoota Boyz flee the table in turn 1 and thats with the Big Meks Kustom Force Field giving them a 5 plus save to something that would normally have caused Instand Death.
    And yet this topic is about the new codex. In case you didn't notice, the OP was talking about 3 model heavy weapon squads. The current ones have 6 models.

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    Well excuse me ffs.
    Sorry i missed one little bit of fine detail.

    Funny how you had nothing god damn contructive to say...

    Eitherway HWs are a very important part of the IG regardless...
    "GOD DAMN THEM ORKS" -
    Senior Officer Corvin - 666th Cadian Defence Force

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