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It seems overpowered
It seems the same
It doesn't matter I'll steam roll them anyway
havn't looked into it
Just wondering if anyone else shares the same concerns over the new Imperial Guard dex as I do. With things like Executioners (5 plasma cannon shots), Banewolfs (flamer template with an AP of 3 and 2+ to wound), and a plethora of AP 3 ordinance is anyone else a tad worried? I know these are only rumors but with the reduction in point costs of guardsmen as well as the addition of a staggering amount of armored nastiness I've been scatching my head as to what I would do in certain situations.
For example with the new squadron rule it is possible to group a Leman Russ Executioner w/ plasma cannon sponsons and a lascannon with a bare bones Leman Russ BT with camo netting. Then all you have to do is obscure the Leman Russ BT or stick it in cover and both tanks get a 3+ cover save.
Second cheesy armored squadron dilemma, Griffons are dirt cheap but are allowed to re-roll the scatter for their shots. So in effect you could group a Griffon with something a bit more menacing Like 2 Basilisks for example. The unit of 3 can fire as a battery and so firing the Griffon first you can re-roll the scatter and keep the 2 Basilisk Templates from straying too far from the target.
Also with orders that add +1 shots to rapid firing weapons or twin-link weapons firing at vehicles or monstrous creatures I feel massive infantry hordes with loads of heavy weapons will be deadly as well.
*link removed* (In the future, please don't post copyright material. It's against forum rules, and copyright infringement. Thanks. ~Rabbit)
and the WarSeer thread:
Thread 1: IG Rumour Summary *No wishlisting please* READ THE FIRST POST FOR SUMMARY - WarSeer
Thread 2: IG Rumour Summary II *Summary in first 2 posts* - WarSeer
Last edited by Rabbit; April 22nd, 2009 at 14:45.
IG are going to be stronger, mostly because a lot of things are getting price cuts and they're getting a whole lot more bodies/armor/shots into lists now than before.
Just a few things before anybody freaks out.
Executioner: Ridiculously expensive, with plasma sponsons and camo netting it costs as much as a Land Raider. Hello cover!
Camo netting must be bought for the whole squadron.
Squadrons are bad. Immobilized = destroyed, which means that glancing hits can destroy them.
The Griffon combo is possible, but Bassies have a 36" minimum range. That means they'll have to expose themselves if you leave your deployment zone.
Bane Wolf (poisoned 2+ AP3 template) is just a flame template, not like the Hellhound. AV12 front, AV10 sides.
AP3 ordnance? Welcome to 5th edition, everybody has cover
Orders really aren't that great. The unit has to be within the command radius (6" for platoon commanders, 12" for company commanders and SCs, 24" for Creed) and pass a Ld test. Only lasguns get +1 shot, not all rapid fire weapons. Twin-linking only affects 1 unit, all orders do in fact.
IG are going to be competitive this time around, but far from overpowered. They can't fight in combat still, their vehicles have poor side and rear armor, cover helps a lot, they suffer from more Ld problems now unless they take Commissars or Regimental Standards, they still give up lots of KPs, can have problems with spacing and getting multi-charged, Valks/Vendettas will never get cover unless they go flat out and their anti-tank is going to be concentrated into specific units (Vets, Vendettas, Devil Dogs).
Nothing to get overly worried about, but it would be wise to start thinking up counters to the new IG.
You definitely make some good points but I would like to clarify a few things. The basilisks/ Griffon combo was just an example you could just as easily pair a Griffon with Manticores, Deathstrikes etc. The Banewolf and the Hellhound both have AV 12 sides not 10 and the trend for IG tanks is they have very strong side armor (every single Russ has 13). As for cover my list thrives on droppods, rhinos and close range firefights, I don't sit back in cover and battle it out over range so possibly the worry of all of the low AP weapons is more of a personal issue. Also the killpoint system is still a little confusing for me so if anyone can offer clarification that would be great. From what I gather you can make a whole platoon one killpoint it just has to act as a single unit or you can split it up into as many squads (and individual killpoints) as you want.
oh look, the majority on the poll have said overpowerd, what a suprise from Marine Players
Is it 12? Oh well, still not that great.
Cover is not hard to get even in a mech or DP army. Get cover from your transport or Pod and don't bunch up.
Griffons can't pair up with Deathstrikes, the other artillery options can be mean but the bunker buster requires LoS and the other artillery still have minimum range.
Every unit = 1 kill point. 10 Assault Terminators = 1 KP, 1 Rhino = KP. Only infantry squads in each platoon can merge, special and heavy weapon squads are separate, as are conscripts and the command squad. It's basically reverse combat squads. Multiple units combining into 1 unit at deployment, making 1 KP.
And Lost Nemesis, marine players get ragged on because of the perception that they're a spoiled lot, getting new Codices every year while other armies (like IG) get nothing for years. So when marine players complain, everyone else gets all self-righteous that the dirty marine players dare raise a voice against their pure and holy awesomeness
IG are definitely not overpowered, if anybody is concerned, voice your opinions and hopefully I can offer some perspective or at least clarification as I have the book.
Alright thanks for the clarification on the killpoints. Plus mabe only the good things have been emphasized in the codex rumors once I get my hands on the actual book things could look different.
and Sorry about the copyrighted material I just wasn't thinking.
Every time a new codex rolls around, things are thought to be overpowered to some degree or another. Remember the cries of overpowered units, and the excitement for Marine players, when the new Space Marines codex was released?
Turns out, it's just different. Some things are better, some things are worse, and even the new units are still just Space Marines, who die just the same as before.
I think as a whole, from a WH40k overall gaming universe that IG are not horribly overpowered or anything.
What I am personally worried about is my main opponent (IG & Ork player) has been waiting for a new Codex, and I'm very glad that its happened. Mainly because games were so off balance before, any Marine force I threw on the table walked on him.
However, as we only play friendly games I'm a little concerned about the extreme amounts of AP3 weaponry available. Without any malicious intent he is going to gravitate towards those storm troopers with the new hellguns. The new 20x shot Russ. I didn't mind facing 10 plasma guns scattered through out his army, and they usually dented me pretty well. but up to 30 Storm Troopers all with the new hellguns will most likely sway this ongoing battle completely the other way. Additionally that won't even dent his point total, and I'll still have to deal with a boat load of heavy armor.
I will contend with mainly an outnumbering force, with superior weaponry. Sounds like a good challenge.
I'm just hoping he doesn't list fix against Marines. As, at the moment, I have no idea how I'm going to face that down.
Last edited by Xpyre35; April 22nd, 2009 at 16:35.
Not too concerned, really.
Not too happy, on Valkies dropping troops on my head ... Sentinels having more choice in weapons, such as plasma cannons ... New rattling sniper models may mean sniper shots being fired back at me ...
All in all, I still have absolute faith in my tank crews.