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Hello, few question about the BT LR
1. Can its passengers assault after they disembark from it even if it moved like a normal SM LR. I can't seem to find where it says it in the codex but I haven't looked too thoroughly
2. If it moves 12" can it shoot a non-defensive weapon? If so at which ballistic skill
3. If it moves 6" can it shoot two non-defensive weapons? (one at BS4, one at BS 2 ?)
Thanks. I'm thinking of starting BT and love LR's so some clarification would be nice. Any tips on how to use their LR's with tharmy would be nice too, thanks.
I'll do my best with what little knoledge I have with the BT codex.
1)You may assault out of Lr's if they have an assault ramp as DEing counts as moving. The only LR in BT with an assault ramp mis the crusader.
2/3) a land raider may move 6" and fire two weapons as it is. yes it may fire a 3rd at bs 4 for reg sm but 2 for BT. 12" and fire 1, a second at BS2.
I admit I've been vague, but I accidently deleted my original reply thanks to a bad keystroke.
1. This is a peculiar one. It has an "front assault ramp" but doesn't really explain what it is. Does it mean you can assault from the front only? It's a little vague, but I believe no one would mind if you played it like the regular space marine LR's, where they can assault from all exits, including the side portals.
2. If it moves over 6", if can't fire anything. Yes, their PotMS sucks that bad.
3. Yes (correct).
I think the reason it's called a "front assault ramp" is because it has the Frag Assault Launchers on it. As most of us know, if you release your men from the front access point, and they assault that same turn they are considered to have frag grenades for that assault. I think what they are getting at is that you can jump out the side access points if you like, but you will ony get the frag bonus if you run out of the front door. As with most other vehichles though, I think the normal rules for disembarking apply.
1) according to both land raider entries in the BT codex, models can DE and assault, regardless of which ramp they actually exit at. In general most ppl tend to favor the frontal ramp as thats the point that is usually closer to the enemy compared to the side hatches.
2) as stated in the above posts, BT don't benefit from the PotMS BS of 4 as in the SM codex
3) thats correct
Sorry still kind of confused. First, where in the codex does it say they can assault and Disembark? Also, if it moves 12" can it fire any weapon at all? I'm assuming it would be at BS2, but I'm kinda getting mixed answers and need further clarification. Thanks for those that are answering too btw.
Edit: I don't think i was clear enough asking the question. Can the land raider MOVE, and then the passengers disembark and then assault that same turn as per the rule assault vehicle in the space marines codex? Normally you can't disembark from a vehicle that moved and assault in the same turn unless its open topped. The space marine land raider says you may still assault from it after you dissembark but I can't find the Black Templar rule that says they can (if it exists). Was there an errata or anything I am not aware about? Or is the BT LR the same points as the SM LR but half as effective? Thanks.
Last edited by Voodoochild87; April 24th, 2009 at 04:00.
It honnestly is a great question because even now as I go back through the BT dex, there really isnt anything written for the "Assault Ramp" or it being a "assault vehicle". It is just simply a "tank". However, from what I would understand (not taking into consideration the rules written in the new dex), is that if models any models come out of the front "assault ramp", they would be able to charge as a squad. However, if you were forced to disembark fromthe two sides hatches (were charged in the front), I don't know if you could assault. It would be something you would need to discuss with your opponent I guess. In my opinion, playing a BT some years back, most people understood the rules as they are now, but you might get some jacka$$ who will say this. However, that's reading it directly as it's written, as there is nothing that exlains the "front asaullt ramp". However, the new dex clearly states any model disembarking from the LR may assault, as it is not an "assault vehicle".
Anyways taking that all into account, you can move 12" and assault out of the the LR. Basically, you could get a charge from 20" away because you are allowed a 2" disembark from the LR, then a possible 6" charge from your 12" already moving. It's fun to do this on a Table Quarters game.
As for the rules of the BT's PotMS, you cannot fire a weapon when you move 12". But, say you move 6", the hurricane bolters sponsons are considered defensive weapons meaning you get to fire both of them. That then leaves you with the option to fire the multi-melta regularly as a main weapon, and can then fire the assault cannon as a PotMS as BS 2(you have to remember you can only fire all weapons at 1 target, this is not the new PotMS rules, it's really confusing because there are 3 varriations on this rule atm)Reason you do this is because the AC is twin-linked. Also, should you suffer a Stunned or Shaken result, you can still move and shoot which can sometimes be useful as opposed to be able to fire an aditional weapon. One more "however", it does specify you can only move forward should you suffer a shaken/stunned result, so no backing up.
Hope that helps.
Last edited by Acez; April 24th, 2009 at 16:30.
Okay, i wrote that wrong and didnt mean "forced" as is the vehicle was destroyed or anything. I meant it as in the unit inside the tank needs to get out just to get out on the opponents turn to deal with the threat infront.
An example. Played yesterday, ran Vulkan and my Termies as a LRC. Shot it before I charged(cause i wanted to charge the people inside) but only caused a Stunned result. LRC couldn't move or shoot his turn. I then proceeded to charge, covering the front and enough of the sides so that he couldnt fit his whole army 2" front the exit without being 1" from me. I didnt kill the tank, unfortunately, with my termies so I was then stopping him next turn from disembarking.
But i guess even if the tank was stationary, and you WERE able to get out on one side, you could still assault, so i guess that really doesn't make sense
Don't want to nitpick here,, but the LRC comes with Extra Armour as standard, meaning that it can never be stunned, only shaken. Unless there's some special rule that Vulkan has, I don't know the generic Space Marine codex very well,I play Templars.