Footslogging Guard, trying to make it work. - Warhammer 40K Fantasy

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  1. #1
    I Expect the Inquisition RecklessFable's Avatar
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    Footslogging Guard, trying to make it work.

    So, just to buck the trend, I'm starting a thread on trying to make All-Infantry Guard viable.

    But Reckless, aren't they obviously viable?
    No, no they aren't. They are actually going to be a royal pain-in-the-ass to make competitive.

    But Reckless, Ork Hordes Rule!
    First, no they don't, not against Mechanized armies. In fact, Mech Guard is going to give Horde Orks fits.

    Ok, not that I believe you, but what are the challenges involved?
    Here we go...

    Utter lack of mobility. We lost Drop Troops for everyone but Stormtroopers. We gained some ability to Outflank, but I'm not convinced footslogging outflankers will really do much for us. Al'Raheim is no Snikrot and his platoon is not a horde of Boyz.

    Anti-tank. Meltas are the new Lascannon, so we have to start thinking about how to deliver anti-tank without vehicles. The choices are walking them in, not bothering and just using MORE lascannons, and... Stormtroopers.

    Wow, I've said Stormtroopers twice now in the context of filling a need. Considering my general opinion of them (OVERPRICED) that is suprising. The other problem is that they are Elites and share that slot with another big gun...

    Psyker Combat Squads! They have a pie plate and random AP. Not bad really, despite the fragility. Getting cover saves from screens helps and they aren't THAT expensive...

    We also have Marbo, Huzzah!

    ...and that is it. Ogryns still suck. Rats aren't going to win an Elites slot... hmmm

    I know, Rough Riders! They can anti-tank, right? Well, I still say they suck, but Slogger Guard might have a use for them. Just probably not in a list I ever intend to win with.

    Oh, and conscripts... they suck, I am sorry, but Chenkov is overprices compared to just buying another platoon of naked LD8 Guardsmen.

    And that really is it. As in, other then HQs, there are no other infantry options. The heavy slot is a loss...

    Let's look at the challenges involved with missions:

    Killpoint Missions: Sure, the amoeba rule has mitigated it somewhat, but All-Infantry Guard is going to need to replace the lost firepower from not taking Heavy Support or Fast Attack choices (unless you cheat and take Sentinels). The obvious way we can do this is with Heavy Weapons squads. Six wounds on three T3 bases. If we take too many of these, it will be possible to end up with so many easy KPs that we'd be back to autoloss.

    The challenge here is to find firepower without going back to having double out opponent's KPs to give.

    The two objective mission, (I forget the name): Get ready to use MOVE! MOVE ! MOVE! a lot. This is where Stormtroopers will thrive. Contesting in the late game might pull off a win here.

    The 2+d3 objective mission: Here we thrive. In the very least, we are one of the few armies that has the manpower to contest every objective. Go hordes!

    Now the heartbreaking moment. Try and build the lists. Despite the point reduction for line squads, your army will still be smaller then you would have thought. All the goodies start to add up. Advisors, Commissars, Elites, Al'Raheim, Creed, Harker, Straken.

    55 dudes + 1 comissar in a platoon will run you 400+ points (I hit 450 myself) without the heavy squads at 75-105 each.

    For around 2000 points I'm coming in around 176 men with 2 psyker squads, marbo, Al'Raheim leading a short platoon and two max platoons with a few heavy squads attached, each with a commissar to keep the ameobas from running. I think it is around 14 KPs. The problem is any assault army will slaughter me as I try to get to objectives.

    Anyways, the intent here is to advance the discussion, not tell you how to play.


    RecklessFable's Journey to Mediocrity (Painting an IG army)
    I've been addicted to World of Tanks lately and neglecting my IG... But it is so... much... fun!

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  3. #2
    Set Sail and Conquer! Cadaver Junkie's Avatar
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    I kinda think that all infantry armies are still quite viable!

    Although I'd be tempted to mellow it out a little with a bunch of sentinels, at least, for some mobile anti-tank.

    Quote Originally Posted by RecklessFable View Post
    Oh, and conscripts... they suck, I am sorry, but Chenkov is overprices compared to just buying another platoon of naked LD8 Guardsmen.
    I kinda half agree, and half not. Chenkov plus without number conscripts have a few useful tricks they bring into the fold. And more so when you add Creed into the mix.

    First trick I can think of involves close combat. You use them as the ultimate speed bump.

    Say that a bunch of death company or khorne beserkers have smashed into your line, and you direct them first onto your conscripts. Start of your next turn, you take them away - and the enemy is perfectly bunched up for any blast/template weapons you might have! Although there is no consolidation into more combat in 5th ed anyway, at least this way your opponent doesn't get to roll a d6 for any extra movement - those troops are stuck all bunched up.

    Second trick - Use Creed's ability to outflank with them.

    They come on the table edge, and in such a manner that your opponent can't afford to ignore them. After they mess up as much **** as they can, and die in droves, drawing and stalling the enemies advance along a flank for a turn or two, you can remove them, bringing them back on to hold an objective down your own end (which you had otherwise ignored), and all of your opponent's units that were sent to take them out are suddenly in the middle of nowhere fighting no-one! This ability would probably work well even with an understrength squad, perhaps 35 conscripts would be all it needs.

    If you add in a commissar lord, what with Creed's command radius, there's a good chance that when they rock up they can all get an extra lasgun shot, or attack twice on the charge with S4I4. Noice!

    I'm sure there's others, but i'm still working on it. (As you can see, I'm taking conscripts! Which does sorta work for my new army, Ultramar PDF during the Tyrannic Wars).
    "Pickles, the drummer, doodily doo. (Ding-dong, doodily, doodily, doo.)"

    Also, you should google "garfield minus garfield". Awesome.

  4. #3
    Member muukip's Avatar
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    I think Creed's ability would work better with a regular guard platoon, who have access to a Commissar to make them fight to the last man. What's the point of having 50 men if they get killed in one or two turns?

    One the other hand, you don't have to use 50 man squads either, I think around 30 models is more manouvrable and affordable.

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