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Does anyone have experience with the Vanguard Veterans including Jump Packs?
I wonder if I should give them either...
a) Lightning Claw/Plasma Pistol
b) Lightning Claw/Lightning Claw
With their "Heroic Intervention" rule the second Lightning Claw looks very nice. But I never played a battle, so I can't say how likely it is to get into assault when they deep-strike in.
Other problem: How do I get lightning claws on my model? Buying a SM Veteran with claws for each Vanguard just to get the claws seems a bit expensive
i dont have lightning claws on my vanguard veterans but i have lightning claws on my termies and i always pair my lightning claws. on this one though i would go with the pistol and claw layout. you still ranged combat as an option and the claw and pistol combo for close combat.
I am an Indestructible master of War.
Personally I go with LC and Storm Shield - however I do agree that there's just not enough claws about to make it cost effective
Stick one or two with a Thunder Hammer in there too, you don't want to get boned by a rampaging Wraithlord :/
i got a 6 man squad with jump packs.
Sgt. relic blade with bolt pistol
1 power fist with bolt pistol
2 power ax with plasma pistol
3 chain sword with plasma pistol
4 chain sword with bolt pistol
5 chain sword with bolt pistol
i think this squad cost around 250 pts. im sure its a little more but i dont have there info in front of me.
I am an Indestructible master of War.
I don't even run the lightning claws, I understand they're power weapons with rerolls for the wounds, but it's just not cost effective. I would just upgrade the Sergeant to have either a relic blade or a powerfist, and it ends up at either 325 or 335.
I serve my master and do as he wants. He wants the badlands, thus they will be his.
-Shriva the Damned
Exactly. The power weapons are the only reason I would get that squad at all (in combination with Heroic Intervention). It's just plain cool if you deep-strike in, assaulting in the same turn with e.g. 5 x 5 power weapon attacks that can reroll failed to-wound rolls.
I don't like the relic blade very much, why?
Relic Blade: Two-Handed means 2 attacks (+1 for assault) at Str 6
Lightning Claw: 2 attacks (+1 for assault) at Str 4, but can reroll for wound
versus an average Toughness of 4, you have a 66,6% chance to wound with the Relic Blade (2+) and a 55,5% chance to wound with a lightning claw (4+, two rolls). But you get an additional attack because you can take a Pistol, if you take another Lightning Claw you get 2 extra attacks.
2 Lightning Claws: 2 attacks (+1 for assault, +1 for second weapon, +1 for same special weapon) = 5 attacks at Str 4 and rerolls.
What I wondered. Is there any situation where you would need a (plasma) pistol instead of a lightning claw? It should not be a problem to get into assault every turn with jump troops.
1st Turn (of the squad): deep-strike and assault, consolidate
2nd Turn: If survived, move, (with Shrike I can get Fleet on them > run) and assault.
I never miss the extra shot from the shooting phase, because with two lightning claws I always get that extra attack in melee. Well, against WS 4 my chance is about 16,6% worse than shooting a ranged weapon. But in melee your enemy doesn't get an armor or cover save ...
If I wanted to have a little more punch against high-wound models or tanks, I would take one or two Thunderhammer.
I agree that they are very expensive for what they do. Maybe they should have jump packs per default with no extra costs, or for 5 points. 10 sounds a little harsh.
I'm pretty sure a vanguard with lightning claws only gets 4 attacks on the charge. 2 basic, 1 for 2 ccw and 1 for charging. You don't add in special close combat attack and +1 for same weapon.
Oh well, that means I only get the second attack when the additional weapon is a lightning claw too. That part of the rulebook is a little confusing. How about Normal + Special Weapon and 2 Special Weapons. With a normal and a special weapon (actually cheaper than 2 special weapons) you get only the bonuses, but with 2 special weapons you also get the penalties!? Sounds weird to me, at least how it reads in the rulebook :confused: (p42)
Ok, say you have 1 lightning claw and a close combat weapon. You won't get any bonuses other than the usual for LCs. You need to have 2 of the same to get the extra attack basically. Ie 2 power fists for another attack for 2 special weapons, same with LC's and thunder hammers. a regular power weapon and bp you get an extra attack though for 2 ccws. LC's work best in a pair anyway. 4 attacks on the charge with the LC's abilities is nothing to scoff at.