Welcome to Librarium Online!
Join our community of 80,000+ members and take part in the number one resource for Warhammer and Warhammer 40K discussion!
Registering gives you full access to take part in discussions, upload pictures, contact other members and search everything!
I am building my first guard army and need some advice.
For fluff reasons and because I love the cadian sniper models I am considering taking special weapon squads with sniper rifles. But I am wary because my space marine scout snipers are now fairly rubbish since their BS dropped to 3. I can't stand ratlings. Anyone got any advice or experience with them.
I am also considering taking a veteran squad with shotguns and carapace armour in a valkyrie for last minute objective grabs. Are shotguns any good?
As for shotguns, they are pretty nice in the right unit. Veterans in a Valk doing objective grabbing is probably not the right unit. They aren't going to get to assault after disembarking from the Valk much more often than not, so they don't give you anything the Rapid Fire of Lasguns would not. Then, say you do the objective grab on Turn 5 and the game continues to Turns 6 and 7, the extra range while sitting on that objective from the lasguns would be more helpful.
Honestly in an IG list I wouldn't consider shotguns very often. Perhaps with vets in a Chimera, as the Chimera will more than likely be moving if possible, negating the benefit of the lasguns extra range while standing still, and if you get shaken/stunned and need to disembark to shoot if you're using special weapons other than plasma guns you COULD also assault if you wanted to and still get your rank-and-file vets shooting.
Really, I'd reccomend using your sniper models as Counts As Ratlings, simply because you get about twice the number of sniper rifles for the same cost, + nifty special rules and BS4.
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC
The reason for using shotguns on Vets is not for last turn types of moves, it is actually best used for Using the Valk's scout move to get to 12.1" from the enemy, On your first turn disembarking 2", Move 6", fire, and then assault. Might as well assault with the guys since they won't survive the next turn.
A shotgun is better than a lasgun is if you plan on assaulting with the unit.
A Lasgun is better for any other purpose.
Both are S3, AP - weapons that can fire twice at 12" range after moving.
The lasgun also has the option to fire once at 24" range if you don't move
The shotgun has the option of being able to assault afterwards.
That's mechanically speaking. Fluffwise, shotguns are just plain cool.
As far as Sniper Rifles - I've always had a thing for them, but they never work out as good in game as I hoped. I still keep using them though.
"The objective is to win, the point is to have fun."
The humble lasgun and its cousin the shotgun fill different rolls. As stated in several of the above posts, a lasgun is more versatile while the shotgun is better used for assaulting.
For veterans mounted in chimeras I use shotguns. This is because my Chimeras will almost always be on the move and as such the lasgun loses its appeal. As the entire unit is armed with assault weapons, they can in a pinch, assault an enemy unit.
For my Valkyrie/Vendetta mounted units I use the lasgun, as they might be able to utilize their lasguns superior range.
As for sniper rifles: I use these bad boys all the time in my static command squad with vanilla commander and Master of Ordinance to pretty good effect, with the volume of fire they pump out they'll almost always get at least one rend. The Cadian sniper models are really niffty, and if nothing else you can use them as 'count as' ratlings, as they have the camo cloaks modeled on them to represent the stealth and infiltrate special rules.
My enemy's enemy is a problem for later. In the meantime, they might be useful.
I always take Shotguns on my Veteran Chimelta squads because, well, I'll be honest. Because they look freakin' awesome.
Sniper rifles saw much reduced effectiveness in 5th. IG will now be hitting on 4+, wounding on 4+. In addition, many common troops choices in the game have high Ld or speciasl rules that help with morale. Pinning simply isn't as easy to pull off anymore. If you are going to use Snipers, at least take a Psyker Battle Squad to lower the enemy Ld first or you're really going to struggle to make them effective.