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So i have been playing ig for a while but only mech lists. i want to play some horde lists but i am very undecided on how to start. im planning on playing a lot of autocannons and plenty of infantry squads. can you all give me a few pointers and guidelines. also some tips on movement.
A couple 10 man squads in front with flamers and no HWT's as a meat shield in case the enemy closes quickly.
9 infantry squads broken into three combined squads of three is nice. Put a commissar with PW as well as 1 or two sarges with PW in each squad. This gives three thirty man stubborn squads, but with three HWT's each.
THrow in a HWS.
Add Creed for the extra orders and 24" command raidius, and Kell or voxcasters to make sure those orders go through.
Now you have 12 twin-linked (using BiD) autocannons or (gasp) las-cannons for a killer alpha-strike. The commisars will help your unit to tarpit anybody who assaults.
Dirty trick... make sure that if you get assaulted, your HWT's are in base contact with the enemy. All guardsmen within two inches of a HWT= a lot of guardsmen that can participate in assault. Combine this with "for the Honour of Cadia" and you now have a pretty decent tarpit unit that will occupy any unit that assaults it (except for maybe berserkers).
For grabbing far objectives, putting a cheap squad (e.g. special weapons team) in a valkyrie is a reasonably priced option.
Last edited by MunDMC; October 5th, 2009 at 04:13.
For 1000pts I'd grab 2 Hefty Platoons of 40 men each. Combine these into 4 squads of 20. Then some HWS to add increased fire power to the wall of humanity.
I'd not bother with conscripts as they Run away to easily and the Lack of special weapons makes them basically useless. If you want a 'mob' to run at an objective grab another platoon of 40, Have 2 squads of 20 and a Commiisar in each.
-Autocannon/G-Launchers work well in Infantry Squads and their respective PCS.
-For the Mob squads i'd grab some Melta Guns so they can deal with anything like Dreads or Tanks trying to tank shock them to death. Give the Sergeants Melta Bombs and the Commissar a Power weaapon.
-HWS, up to you. Autocannons work well and are reliable but if your Infantry all ready have these you're going to need something to take on heavier tanks like Predetors and Hammer Heads. Lascannons are ok but you'll need to invest in something so they can use orders (a Commi Lord or Kell)
You'll still need some mobile elements in your force to capture objectives. so a couple of Chimeras holding PCS or picking up random SWS could work. Valks/ Vends holding the same or Vets is another option to you.
Write up a list and throw it up on the Army List section.
40 models for 1 troop and it's 22 dollars for 10 of them
i don't know how you guard players bear it
It's the satisfaction we get knowing we play the best army out there
i hope you're not referring to my armies as lesser just because we have older codices!
but, if that's the price for an update codex, it's a price i will gladly not pay!
and so on
Originally guardsmen came in cool twenty man boxes for thirty five or so dollars.
The majority of veteran players can take the horde army in stride because that was originally all you could really do with Imperial Guard; spam large masses of expendable men, stagger them so on the consolidation they don't get assaulted and hope you can outlast the enemy. Thus, most fourth edition players will have plenty of men to go around.
As for you new guys, I can't say anything other than GW's pretty lame.
Now, onto the actual army itself:
As everyone has mentioned before, infantry squads that aim to go forward, special weapons only. Infantry that aims only to sit, heavy and special. Creed and Kell are almost necessary, as they lend you four orders, of which you will use all, and the ability to use Creed's Ld on the squads, which is necessary for Heavy Weapon teams.
Infantry squads that plan on moving forward should have a flamer or melta gun. They're only dangerous at twelve, so let's keep everything simple like that. The GL isn't worth it, as they need something damaging at the range they plan on engaging. A few GL shots on the way there isn't as striking as a flamer. Besides, if you need a GL for it, that's why your stationary squads are there.
Stationary squads that sit on the objective, give them an AC and GL, or ML and GL, or LC and GL if you feel like it. Don't bother with the plasma gun.
Heavy weapons squads will be your only real concentration of long range fire. I'd take two auto cannons for every lascannon team you take; transports are going to be your first target, as they are what give the opponent the edge against you wall of flesh. Destroy that and they should be easy pickings, for masses of guardsmen anyway.
As for your command squad, I always take quad flamers, while the HQ command takes meltas. Eventually, something will kill through your wall of flesh, whether it be hard assault troops or a tank shock. These weapons will be your answer to that. As for special weapon squads, I feel they're a waste, as you can already get an equivalent by using the platoon command.
You may want to invest in storm troopers, as they're the only DS infantry we have that actually has the bloody rule. Marbo may be necessary as well.
It's a fact: Lascannons can't kill tanks that well. Thus, you'll need something that can get in their grill without a vehicle: Storm Troopers or Marbo.
Then there's the whole combining squads question. Automatically most people combine squads, and I will admit in most cases, it is the better idea.
But, against certain armies, say assault armies, it is best to leave your squads separated and deploy staggered, in such away that the assault can only hit the front most expendable squad. After they all die, flame the remains. Rinse and repeat; while you've taken a heavy toll, your foe has taken much worse.
In this way I've chewed down dedicated assault armies or armies that rely heavily upon the assault phase. Granted, you may say "What idiot will fall for that?" and I will say "More than you think." Your entire army is made up of separate, small units. If the enemy wants to use that precious assault phase, he's going to have to take it. Stagger right, and he won't be able to charge multiple squads.
Granted, this will waste you in Kill Points, but in this manner it is quite possible to kill most of, if not all of the enemy army.
I normally keep my expendable forward squads separate, as I plan for them to die, but my blobbed stationary squads get a Commissar; I am keeping this objective thank you very much.
But, with the horde army, prepare to get very frustrated with the shooting and moving phase. Both you, and your opponent.
Also, prepare a lot of dice. You'll probably spend over the course of the battle several hundred, if not a thousand, lasgun shots.
Furthermore, recognize that your entire army is expendable. Remember that you can waste dozens of models to take an objective and it will almost always be worth it because your men are so cheap.
In addition, don't forget you too can assault. Sometimes it's better to make an assault and waste your opponent's movement and shooting phase, than to take a rack of bolter fire. Either way, you eventually die, but in one manner you greatly inconvenience the enemy, in the other you are just a kill point.
I'd elaborate more, and I'd be a bit more detailed, but I'm tired. Maybe more later.
Get to know our special characters. Most of them are wasted in mechanized regiments but, when there's a lot of men to be driven around, they come into their own. Al'Rahem in particular is important in heavy-infantry as he's the best non-vehicle way to get out of your deployment zone. Creed is gold, although some players opt for two Company Command Squads instead. Artillery is more useful in infantry lists than the other types as well; a hammer-anvil strategy of Basilisks forcing the enemy to rush towards an entrenched gunline is pretty much the ideal situation for Guard.
Don't sweat the kill points. If you aren't bringing two infantry squads then you're likely bringing one in a Chimera...the math comes out the same either way and over-obsessing will only cripple you in 2/3 of normal games. Take ground, hold ground and let the Emperor sort out the dead.
God, I love playing Guard. Statements like that last one get my blood moving!
"My tanks have names, my men have numbers." -Col. Edmund Grahvess, 23rd Kronecker Prison Guard
I'm enjoying my infantry guard more and more.
The orders are very important for all infantry / infantry heavy.
I'm designing my infantry squads with combining units in all games now -
I get, say three infantry squads, add one vox, a comissar (with power sword if i have points) and three meltaguns / grenade launchers. First rank second rank is devastating. I'll normally run the other two squads with autocannons, vox and plasma gun, or grenade launchers. If it's kp's i'll combine all squads, if i'm gonna get whacked by commando's, sm scouts / outflankers i'll keep them seperate, if not i'll combine them for order synergy.
Combining squads also means i can have a "tail" of infantry so i'm close to my command squad r.e. orders.
I prefer two command squads to creed and kell, and do the following:
I like outflanking with penal troops and harker vets, (or vend / valks with vets) so take an astropath. the squad he's in has grenade launchers, and start in standard reserve. He can't be shot then. The other squad has a AC typically, and starts firmly in cover - don't hesitate to go to ground.
Don't forget, if your command squad and other squads have gone to ground on turn 1, if your 2nd command squad turns up they tell a squad to get back into the fight, then the command squad, who can tell more to get up, or do other stuff.
I like giving ll command squads power fists and vox'es as per standard, pcs's normally get grenade launchers or the odd flamer - they're to counter charge (and do first rank, second rank at best. otherwise they're just compulsory and that's why i have them. If i've got valks / vends i'll pack one with 4 flamers so if i'm playing a horde army i stuff it in the flyer (as my vets will have melta's))
My opinion on the special characters:
4x orders, to 24" very expensive. I do like him, but he rarely gets into a list as i want to put him in a chimera to protect the investment, and it ends up being expensive (and i prefer to have lots of tanks or none at all). besides, he doesn't have a power fist.
I am even fonder of kell - shove him with a normal officer and get your heavy weapons to do orders (at good odds of completing them). and he has a fist and standard for free. (The only time i run standards.)
Awsome. shoot & run? what, shoot my lasguns and run? turn up en mass outflanking? He's just awsome. Takes objectives. highly recommended.
Uses conscripts. I hate conscripts. They're awful - pay a little bit more for so much more, and you can combine squads nowerdays anyway.
I like harker, he lets me outflank, it's a shame he doesn't have a fist. he does come with a move and fire BS4 heavy bolter, and stealth (on the squad) so it's not all bad.
A rare choice by me. It means i can't take a fist, although his special rule (always regrouping) is nice.
Adeptus Mechanicus Marines: http://www.librarium-online.com/foru...ml#post1655065