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  1. #1
    Member WAAAGHAKI's Avatar
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    Vanilla Space Marines

    Sorry to buck the trend here, but I've got a question about vanilla space marines. I'm not talking about the fancy french vanilla smurfs with the bean specs and slightly yellow tint. I'm talking about all white vanilla with no artificial flavorings.

    I swore a long time ago I'd never play marines because everyone else does. However, I fell and hit my head recently and when I awoke I liked the idea of owning a marine army.

    I'm in the process of building a Death Wing army from the DA codex (calling it a different chapter though). The DA codex looks like the no frills version of the latest marine codex. Not being satisfied with just building a single army style army (I like list-smithing), I was looking at how to build my new-found chapter out.

    It occurred to me that everyone is playing with the latest and greatest toy. I've seen a lot of builds with special characters or units. This works for me when I'm playing against these armies with my guard because expensive units die just as quickly as a cheap unit when it finds itself under a Demolisher template.

    Has anyone played a pure "vanilla" list? This is what I was thinking:

    Some generic HQ
    6x 10 man tactical squads w/flamer and missile launcher in Rhinos
    2x 5 man devastator squads w/missile launchers in a Razorback with TLLC

    This comes in at just under 2K points. If I combat squad the tactical squads, that gives me 14 missile launchers (good for hordes and armor), 6 flamers, 2 TLLCs, and a partridge in a pear tree.

    It's not the most exciting list, but it's one that isn't seen a lot. If I played against this with my guard, I can see it being an issue because of all the targets and anti-armor.

    Has anyone done something like this before?


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  3. #2
    Egg Head Miniatures:fbook And Justice For All's Avatar
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    I've tried something like this with mixed success. You will struggle with fast CC orientated armies and also ones with plenty of high toughness mc's. Tau could also cause you issues as they can out shoot you very easily even though you have plenty they shoot further and kill you quick.

    I'd consider getting some Landspeeder Typhoons. Drop the devs for them even. Much cheaper and allow you to target find as opposed to just sitting hoping your enemy will get in view. That'll be 2 missiles and a HB per turn from each. That's hordes, infanrty, heavy infantry and light armour delt with for cheap points.

    Assault squad is a consideration and maybe a dred or two in pods.

    Obviously if you are looking at pure infantry then not all of this is relevant but I hope it gives food for thought.

  4. #3
    That Which Has No Time Red Archer's Avatar
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    Well, I don't exactly use special characters and/or the newest toys in my list (generic captain on bike, bike troops, speeders and vindicators for fire support), but I don't know if you would consider that as pure vanilla.
    Anyway, I don't think the above list would be all too effective. It's kind of an attempt at a "horde" Space Marine list and it will definitely have a chance against most armies and be quite hard to beat for some. But there's just so much more effective list builds if you use only a few other units and/or upgrades.

    Missile launchers and twin-linked lascannons are fine. But they aren't reliable anti-tank. Only thing you can really count on is melta weapons at half their maximum range. Even the melta special rule and DS1 rule don't guarantee success, but they make it a lot more probable.
    With all those missile launchers you'd have to focus many shots and therefore the shooting of many units onto very few targets in order to cause damage. Power weapons and thelike will eat through your army while you have absolutely nothing to counter close combat. Etc...

    Spamming Marines is probably viable, but only plain tactical squads is probably not the best idea. It's really just the masses that could make this list work, and actually I play Space Marines because I don't want the board full of my models. I want a small, surgical strike force. Elite and hard-hitting.

  5. #4
    UnderWater Ninja-Tiger .. Xpyre35's Avatar
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    I too rarely use any characters in my Ultramarines list. On rare occasions, I pop in Tigirus for the multi-psyker uses and the re-roll reserves.

    I do however, often find myself using Sgt. Telion alot now-a-days. But he can be 'counts as' some other equally effective DA Scout Sgt.

    However, I find pure foot slogging marines, are easily compensated for. They are very slow, and any army with even a moderate amount of transports, or straight out speed, can shred units 1 by 1. And with only a pair of razorbacks, all of the available AT weaponry, will most likely cut through their limited armor, rather quickly.

  6. #5
    UnderWater Ninja-Tiger .. Xpyre35's Avatar
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    edit: Site multi-posted the reply. Looks like xanosaucy was a victim too.
    Last edited by Xpyre35; October 22nd, 2009 at 18:30.

  7. #6
    Member xanosaucy's Avatar
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    Agreed, you don't have to use ALL Tactical Squads you have the options of adding Assault Squads for Faster strikes, Sternguard for the flexibility or Assault Terminators to clean up the place. The Tactical Squad should be your foundation as they are not as flexible or specialized like the other units.

    But if you plan on sticking with this idea I recommend adding 3 Meltagun's, 2 Plasmaguns and leave it at 1 Flamer. Reason is you have more than enough firepower to shred small hordes as it is so Flamer's are almost redundant. Heavily armoured tanks will be a bane to a list like this, you'll need 6's all day long for a Missle Launcher to GLANCE a Leman Russ/Land Raider. Melta's help this Marine imbalance.
    Powerfists on 3 of your Sgt's will help a great deal as well with this idea.

    At 2,000 points you have alot to work with so don't limit yourself if you can avoid it.

    Have fun!
    "A Space Marine Sgt. not taking a Powerfist makes as much sense as peeing with your pants on...you just don't do it." xanosaucy

  8. #7
    Member xanosaucy's Avatar
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    Agreed, you don't have to use ALL Tactical Squads you have the options of adding Assault Squads for Faster strikes, Sternguard for the flexibility or Assault Terminators to clean up the place. The Tactical Squad should be your foundation as they are not as flexible or specialized like the other units.

    But if you plan on sticking with this idea I recommend adding 3 Meltagun's, 2 Plasmaguns and leave it at 1 Flamer. Reason is you have more than enough firepower to shred small hordes as it is so Flamer's are almost redundant. Heavily armoured tanks will be a bane to a list like this, you'll need 6's all day long for a Missle Launcher to GLANCE a Leman Russ/Land Raider. Melta's help this Marine imbalance.
    Powerfists on 3 of your Sgt's will help a great deal as well with this idea.

    At 2,000 points you have alot to work with so don't limit yourself if you can avoid it.

    Have fun!
    "A Space Marine Sgt. not taking a Powerfist makes as much sense as peeing with your pants on...you just don't do it." xanosaucy

  9. #8
    Member xanosaucy's Avatar
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    Agreed, you don't have to use ALL Tactical Squads you have the options of adding Assault Squads for Faster strikes, Sternguard for the flexibility or Assault Terminators to clean up the place. The Tactical Squad should be your foundation as they are not as flexible or specialized like the other units.

    But if you plan on sticking with this idea I recommend adding 3 Meltagun's, 2 Plasmaguns and leave it at 1 Flamer. Reason is you have more than enough firepower to shred small hordes as it is so Flamer's are almost redundant. Heavily armoured tanks will be a bane to a list like this, you'll need 6's all day long for a Missle Launcher to GLANCE a Leman Russ/Land Raider. Melta's help this Marine imbalance.
    Powerfists on 3 of your Sgt's will help a great deal as well with this idea.

    At 2,000 points you have alot to work with so don't limit yourself if you can avoid it.

    Have fun!
    "A Space Marine Sgt. not taking a Powerfist makes as much sense as peeing with your pants on...you just don't do it." xanosaucy

  10. #9
    Member xanosaucy's Avatar
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    Agreed, you don't have to use ALL Tactical Squads you have the options of adding Assault Squads for Faster strikes, Sternguard for the flexibility or Assault Terminators to clean up the place. The Tactical Squad should be your foundation as they are not as flexible or specialized like the other units.

    But if you plan on sticking with this idea I recommend adding 3 Meltagun's, 2 Plasmaguns and leave it at 1 Flamer. Reason is you have more than enough firepower to shred small hordes as it is so Flamer's are almost redundant. Heavily armoured tanks will be a bane to a list like this, you'll need 6's all day long for a Missle Launcher to GLANCE a Leman Russ/Land Raider. Melta's help this Marine imbalance.
    Powerfists on 3 of your Sgt's will help a great deal as well with this idea.

    At 2,000 points you have alot to work with so don't limit yourself if you can avoid it.

    Have fun!
    "A Space Marine Sgt. not taking a Powerfist makes as much sense as peeing with your pants on...you just don't do it." xanosaucy

  11. #10
    Member xanosaucy's Avatar
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    Agreed, you don't have to use ALL Tactical Squads you have the options of adding Assault Squads for Faster strikes, Sternguard for the flexibility or Assault Terminators to clean up the place. The Tactical Squad should be your foundation as they are not as flexible or specialized like the other units.

    But if you plan on sticking with this idea I recommend adding 3 Meltagun's, 2 Plasmaguns and leave it at 1 Flamer. Reason is you have more than enough firepower to shred small hordes as it is so Flamer's are almost redundant. Heavily armoured tanks will be a bane to a list like this, you'll need 6's all day long for a Missle Launcher to GLANCE a Leman Russ/Land Raider. Melta's help this Marine imbalance.
    Powerfists on 3 of your Sgt's will help a great deal as well with this idea.

    At 2,000 points you have alot to work with so don't limit yourself if you can avoid it.

    Have fun!
    "A Space Marine Sgt. not taking a Powerfist makes as much sense as peeing with your pants on...you just don't do it." xanosaucy

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