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I wish to start an IG force, though no stranger to 40k, this will be my first attempt at IG.
I plan to make lists at 250/500/750/1000/1250/1500/1750/2000pts, and I'm aiming for the typical stoic gun line though I'm interested in adding some mounted choices.
I tend to play, at my local GW store and such, against all races of 40k.
Forgive me, if this post becomes long, as I'm going to ask everything that's on my mind...
1. How would you go about in building a CCS for a mostly stoic list?
2. Which regimental advisors should I take?
3. What are your opinions on the lord commissar, and how many commissars should I have in my force?
4. Do psykers bring anything to a IG force, and how many techpriests should I have in my list?
1. What are your opinions on ogryn and ratling squads? I really like to add some snipers and I do like the idea of having some CC troops.
2. Psyker battle squad? That's a question in itself.
3. How useful are storm troopers, and how would you use them in my force idea?
4. I wasn't aiming to use characters in my list, but I like guardsman marbo. How can I use him to great affect?
1. How would I gear my infantry platoons?
2. Should I take heavy/special weapon squads? If so, which types?
3. What of conscripts and penal legion squads? Useful or not?
4. Should I take veteran squads? If so, how to gear them?
Fast Attack :
1. I do like the idea of rough rider squads, and would like to include at least one. Has anyone used them, what did you use them for, and how well have they worked?
2. I like the idea of a hellhound/devil dog/bane wolf squadron, being a mobile anti-troop choice. Your opinions?
3. What really got me hooked on IG, was the valkyrie/vendetta. Warplanes is one hobby of mine, so I have to get those models. So I like the idea of transporting troops, but also like the the idea of aircraft strafing the battlefield. Your suggestions?
Heavy Support :
I'm only interested in the leman russ tank variants and the basilisk. What are your suggestions/opinions on filling up my 3 slots?
Thanks to anyone, who read my post, and all suggestions/opinions are welcome.
1: CCS, I'd just grab a Heavy weapon and a Vox. If you're going Infantry heavy a Standard is pretty handy. Don't throw too many points at these guys or they'll ned up to much or a target and die quickly. Keep them cheap and make your opponent not care about them.
2: I wouldn't take any. They bring unwanted attention to your CCS. Others seem to love them though so hey it's all personal choice at the end of the day.
3: Lord Commisar is cool, He's fluffy but there are better ways of spending those points. If you are going to have blobbed squads of say 20 guys that advance then take a normal commi. In Sit back and shoot squads it's personal opinion. They're a boon and a curse sometimes as you WANT your troops to run away so you can shoot the enemy unit.
4: Tech Priests. The precise number you should bring is 0. they are to expensive. Psykers (HQ and PBS) are fun and hurty but your opponent wont let them stay around for long. If you take a PBS take a Chimera.
1: OGryns and Ratlings. Fluffy and fun but too expensive for what they do. Ratlings work well with PBS but for the points you could buy something that will kill the opponent rather than just pin them.
2: Same as the HQ
3: They're expensive and not too great. Good against Eldar but thats about it. Theres 2 ways to use them and they are
1: Squads of 5 with 2 Melta guns. They drop out the sky next to a tank and melt it.
2: A big squad of 10 with no upgrades. They can Rapid fire MEQs but you'll be lucky to get their points back. There are better units.
4: MArbo is brilliant but is a one hit wonder. Don't expect him to live after he pops out and nukes a unit with his Democharge.
1: Autocannon and G-Launcher work best in Infantry Squads. Although there are lots and lots of builds out there. theres been whole threads on tactics and set ups for the humble Infantry squads so check those out.
2: If you take one HWS take 3. Make them all the same type.
3: Conscripts are fun but the low LD means they'll fail their LD test and leg it. You're better off with Blobbed Infantry squads as they are braver, can take special weapons and can have a commissar.
4: You don;t need Veteran Squads but they are a very useful unit. Their higher BS and ability to take 3 Special weapons of varying types makes them a hugly versatile unit. 3 Melta Guns and a Chimera is a pretty bog standard build that is cheap and effective against tanks. Just like Infantry squads theres been whole topics about these so check them out.
1: I've used rough rider units and love them. They're not competetive but they're fun. If they get the charge they can take down Terminator squads easily and for a measly 55pts. Don't worry about making them big squads or they'll be too much of a target.
Bane Wolves are sick against pretty much anything. A total MEQ killer.
Devil Dogs. Seem ok but i've never used one myself. I always have anti-tank covered by other units.
Hell Hound. The Bane of Hoards.
3: Not used them myself as i'm a Tread head not an Air head. They are one of the most underpointed vehicles. Vendettas are brilliant for holding back and sniping vehicles but due to them holding back they're not the greatest for transporting troops. The Valk is good as it can move 12" and still fire which makes them perfect troop carriers. Always give Valks missile Pods.
2 Demolishers with just Hull H-Flamers backed up with a Squadron of 2 Griffons for hoard killing or 2 Hydras for transport killing works wonders. Which ever your list needs
Lord Borak has covered it well. I just have 2 things to add:
1) Commissar Lords are best used to keep Heavy Weapons Squads from running away when sneezed at. The idea is that you put up to 4 squads within 6" of him so they get to use his leadership. Problem is, this only solves half the problem with HWSs. Sure they'll now stay put when they're shot at, but your 2-wound HW bases will still be insta-killed by assault cannons, multi-lasers, and plasma cannons. HWSs in the old codex were really hard to kill when in cover, as the loaders could be taken off first. But in the new codex they're a single 2-wound model. So I would favor putting HWTs in line squads instead.
2) The best way to use Rough Riders is to put them in reserve at the start of the game. By turn 3 or 4 when they come on (you DON'T want an Astropath) the enemy should now be on your half of the table. So move on 6", run d6", and charge 12". You'll be able to hit anything within 19-24" of your long table edge.
They work great in small games, and not so well in large games. Taking more than one unit is never worth it, and there are other Fast Attack choices that tend to be good in all situations, rather than just a counter-charge threat for a gun line.
To address the initial questions, I have little to add except that the regimental standard for the CCS is a wonderful asset for static lists.
"...and thee shall know the Emperor's might when thy enemies fall before thy guns. No crude Orkish blade can pierce thy anointed armor, nor any twisted alien resist the sting of thy sword." ~Major Kaelen Rhodes
Got to agree with you there Rhoaran. The lack of Carapace armour has just made them to easy to knock out by small arms fire (which is a bad thing). The only reason i use them is because Kasrkin on Bikes look so flipping cool.
But no i'd not thought about leaving them in reserve either. Mighty good idea there Kgoreham.
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Lots has been covered already. Listen to Borak, he's a good 'un, but here's my two cents also:
2. Astropath is good, the rest are negligible. Officer of the Fleet actually helps your opponent.
3. I like him, but he'll hardly ever be worth his points. If you have a lot of large 'blob' squads (2-5 Platoon Infantry Squads merged together) then Commissars are a good buy (one in each). Otherwise, you could easily leave them out.
4. Primaris Psyker is a fairly cheap buy, but weak (S3 Force Weapon? Err...) with an unpredictable shooting attack. Not usually worth his points because a CCS is better. Techpriests are rarely worth it. Instead of upgrading a few tanks and repairing them, just buy more.
2. Psyker Battle Squads are excellent. Weaken Resolve is one of the better powers in the game, most definitely. Combine it with pinning weapons (mortars, artillery tanks, sniper rifles) and you can stop even the toughest units like Nob Bikers or Seer Councils in their tracks. Two of the dirtiest tricks is using a Culexus Assassin (11+ AP1 shots) or Callidus Assassin (2+ Instant Death flamer!) with Psyker Battle Squads.
3. They're okay if you fight a lot of Space Marine armies, but I usually leave them at home. They're very expensive and at the end of the day are still T3 4+, but not even scoring. If you do use them, you need to have a specific mission and objective in mind for them. Never just take them 'because you can'.
4. Marbo is great. Very cheap, flexible and don't underestimate the power of a sneaky AP2 Pie-plate! He's worth it for that weapon alone.
2. Generally, no. Special weapons can be fielded en-masse in Veteran, Company Command and Platoon Command squads instead. Heavy Weapons are for Infantry Squads and tanks. The problem with Heavy Weapon Platoons is that they are Ld7 and can't take voxes (limiting the usefulness of Orders), but also that they consist of three T3 W2 models. Something like a Multilaser (S6 Heavy 3) could get lucky and wipe the whole squad out. S6 vs T3, Instant Death.
3. Infantry Squad blobs are better than Conscripts, because you can take Heavy/Special weapons. Penal Legion can add some flair and fun to an army, but with unreliable abilities they are only useful for harassment with their Scout rule.
4. Veteran Squads are a great choice, one of our best. 70 points each, BS4, 0-3 Special Weapons and 0-1 Heavy Weapon. The most popular combination is 3 Meltaguns and a Chimera, the 'Chimelta' squad. Only 155 points each, they're a steal. Plasmaguns are a good option, but remember to use orders to twin-link them so you don't fry yourself. Sgt. Harker is a good upgrade, but gets a little expensive quickly. Overall, a very flexible and useful unit.
2. All are great options. Take a couple of Bane Wolves and watch your opponent sweat. Devlid Dog is, in my opinion, the least useful one because we can take more reliable Melta options elsewhere. BS3, remember.
3. One of the strongest Imperial Guard lists right now is the all-aircraft mounted one. Take 6-9 Valks/Vends, mount full of CCS and Veteran Squads loaded with Melta and Plasma. Outflank everything (Astropath helps) and stomp all over your enemy. Can put out a ridiculous number of S4 pie-plates and Lascannon shots, then you have all the Melta for anti-tank backup. One of the most useful units in the IG Codex. Only drawback to the above army is that it is quite expensive.
Basilisk is not very useful due to it's minimum range. You have to then get into the open, where you'll get shot to bits. Collossus, Manticore or Medusa are rock-solid artillery options.
Without the initial rush, it's essentially a squadroned Eldar list. Making it very expensive, both money and points wise, for what it does. I saw a 6-Valk list at the 'Ard Boyz semis, and he ended up on the last table by the end of the day.
My own view is that Valks are best used as 2-3 single choices to support a more traditional armored force.
Veteran squads are a great choice. But they're not for me. Since all of my line squads are meched up, there's nobody listening if my officers give orders. So they become my short-bus chimelta squads. Lower BS, sure, but I can give them up to four meltas, and what else are they going to do since there are no dismounts to order around? In light of the fact that I have three command squads chimeltaed up, I find that I have no further requirement for such units...if I needed more than three chimelta squads, of course I'd reach for the vets.4. Veteran Squads are a great choice, one of our best. 70 points each, BS4, 0-3 Special Weapons and 0-1 Heavy Weapon. The most popular combination is 3 Meltaguns and a Chimera, the 'Chimelta' squad. Only 155 points each, they're a steal. Plasmaguns are a good option, but remember to use orders to twin-link them so you don't fry yourself. Sgt. Harker is a good upgrade, but gets a little expensive quickly. Overall, a very flexible and useful unit.
I guess what I'm saying is that command squads are a viable alternative to vets for chimelta duties...and since you're forced to take command squads anyway...
Oh, and my favorite kit for the line squads in an infantry platoon is a chimera and an autocannon. The chimera costs a bit more than a grenade launcher, but it gives you six S5/6 shots instead of the S6 template...and it upgrades you from flak armor to AV12! But if you aren't spamming chimeras, then yeah, autocannon and grenade launcher.
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