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After watching an interesting game, where a IG player sniped/pinned two squads of a farseer/bodyguard, I'm itching to add some snipers.
Should I bring squads of ratlings, arm BS4 models with them, or both?
I'm also looking to filling my force's second HQ choice with an inquisitor, and hoping to squeeze in a vindicator assassin. How well does a VA perform in the 5th, as I so loved them in the last edition(s)? How should I arm my inquisitor? (I currently have the DH book).
Thanks in advance
On snipers, eh, I think they suck. The IG player got lucky with pinning, especially against a LD10 farseer. Did the IG player hit the with weaken resolve from a PBS?
In 5th edition there are so many things out there with high leadership, fearless, or something other special rule that really makes pinning unreliable. On top of that you actually have to kill something which sniper rifles don't do very well as rending is also very unreliable. I'd honestly save your points and do something else.
On the Inquisitor Lord (you have to take one in order to use an assassin) it depends. I'd say keep him as cheap as possible. A pair of mystics and maybe a warrior (or three). Other than that, maybe a Psychic Hood or Emperor's Tarot to keep him cheap. Bolt Pistol + CCW when you don't have any other stuff to spend points on. Shove him in an IG chimera or give him a rhino w/ smoke + EA from the DH codex. That's my opinion on this guy, others will think differently and it all depends on your local metagame.
Of all the assassin choices I think the Vindicare is one of the worst (around there with the Culexus), especially considering how much you pay for him and that you might kill 2-4 models in a game (roughly guessing, too lazy to go through the statistics). You'd be better off with an Eversor or a Calidus both of them have some nice special rules, are nasty in a fight, and are very versatile.
Unfortunatly Snipers are no longer good weapons. Infact there no longer 'alright' in my opinion either. Rending and pinning are nice little effects but other than that thats it. Yourve better off with just taking other weapons. Hell even Grenade launchers are better agaisnt most opponents.
The only way you can really make Snipers reliable is to combine them with Psyker Battle Squads. These use Weaken resolve on them and then hopefully you kill one with snipers and get an easy pin. To do that you need Ratlings (50pts) and a PSB in a chimera (120ptsish). 170pts just to pin a squad and not kill it? You could buy a Demolisher and actually KILL the enemy unit instead. Whats better??
The only time i've taken Ratlings is when i've known i'm up against someone with 3 Wraith Lords.
Inquisitors are alright but remember they're only human and like your Company commander are fairly squishy no matter what equipment you give them. A useful build for them is a couple of mystics and a psychic hood. The Mysitcs will alow your nearby units to shoot Deep Strikers when they come in and the Hood will help you defend yourself against Psykers.
Again theres a downside to this too. It sometimes gets expensive and then you play someone who has no Deep Strikers or Psykers then your Inquisitors a waste of points and an easy kill point.
The Vindicare is in my opinion the coolest model. However his rules are FAR from good. I'd look at the others as well.
The Celuxus is fun againt Enemy psykers but is very specialist.
The Evesor is just Closecombat Death. In my opinion he's the most fun. You pull the pin out and point him in the dirrection of the enemy.
The Callidus is also nasty in Combat and has some nasty gear like the nural shredder.
How many points are you going to be spending on an Inquisitor Lord and an Assassin? Is it worth it?
What Hockeyman said.
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Snipers are like many other things IG can take, lots of potential on paper, not good in games. Fearless and Ld8+ is everywhere in 40k and almost nothing reduces Ld. You could use a PBS to do it, but that;s a complete waste and STILL will have games it does nothing.
I agree, it was all luck. Leave snipers at home. If you want pinning, take Ordnance Barrages or Mortars, they will do damage.
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Thank you all for your answers.
I'll keep my force a 'pure' IG list
I'm personally in favour of all the things these guys dislike, but I kinda stick out like a sore thumb among guard... I play with snipers, grenade launchers, and las/autocannons, with no plasma or melta to speak of, and have never touched a PSB
Yet I've recently been told I'm the cheeziest list in my 30-man league. Go figure.
Anyways, as to the original question: I like sniper rifles, but not b/c of pinning (As has been pointed out, that's a rare occurence these days). I like snipers b/c they're a long range weapon that has 50/50 wound against ANY unit, and a 17% chance of penetrating armour.
Last edited by Jemal; November 24th, 2009 at 22:06.
"The objective is to win, the point is to have fun."
In my opinion, there are only three good snipers in the game. Eldar Rangers, Eldar Pathfinders (upgraded rangers), and Vindicare assasins (sp?).
Rangers are what any sniper should be. Boost cover save, good chance to hit, and lots of changes to ignore armour.
Pathfinders are the Cadillac of Snipers, IMO.
Whenever Imperial Guard players complain about snipers sucking, they get blank looks from us Eldar players. especially the solitaires! ;D
A more accurate statement might be "Mon-keigh snipers suck." We still have our uber-deathsticks.
Last edited by rafis117; November 25th, 2009 at 12:24.
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I like sniper rifles. I don't rely on pinning or rending but it is nice when it happens. And they are cheap and good range. I use them in a veteran squad with a heavy bolter and harker (extra heavy bolter and infiltrate and stealth). Only 25 more for harker with his stuff than just camo cloaks. Then I can infiltrate them in a good spot and put out a lot of bullets that wound easier. Works well for me.
The Vindicare is a good model but not many like him. He can shoot a specific model regardless of targeting restrictions. You must shoot at high priority targets to make it worth it - but they cannot hide behind a cheap squad. Shoot IG commanders, any heavy guns hidden in squads, SM chaplains attached to assault squads... You can even shoot into close combat! The only downfall is he only gets 5 or 6 shots per game. But he can rack up some points in significant kills. I like the evorsor more (cheap and self destructs, charges far, lots of attacks).
We don't use the Inquisitors-we still use the assassin codex. GW isn't going to make us buy crap or shelf an expensive model :p