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Are Honor Guards and Command Squads both considered retinue? What exactly are they?
Are they worth the points? Apothecaries seem reliable? On bikes?
And always remember the first rule of Warhammer...
(And it has nothing to do with "not talking about Warhammer.")
No they are not retinues, they are simply regular squads of infantry in game terms. The captain/chapter master that chooses to take a command squad/honour guard squad doesn't have to join the squad, and if he does he can choose to leave it again.
As for their usefulness, other people can probably answer that better than I can.
Thou shalt remember:
Warhammer Fantasy armies do NOT have Codices. They have Army Books.
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Ancalgon hit it on the head with their tabltop deployment and how HQ's work with or without them.
I have limited experiance of using a Command Squad and none for Honour Guard.
Re: Command Squad. Ok on foot but need to be delivered where they will be of use, and for the points there are better options in th codex. Used an 'on foot' unit a couple of times and found myself wanting on both occasions.
On bikes is a whole other realm of goody fun. Not going to say you should bike a squad up for tourneys but for generic games (esp' where an all bike or highly mobile force is being used) they are good. You just need to plan what you want them to do and point accordingly. Mine are cc orientated and go hunting heavy infantry and HQ units. Always with a biker Capt or Khan.
Re: Honour Guard. POINTS! I think that covers their problem.
I sometimes play with Honour Guard. (I own the UM HG models). They are a TON of fun, but not point-efficient. They are veterans so they get 2 base attacks. They can have 2 CC weapons so will get 3 attacks normally, 4 if they charge, and 5 if you add in the chapter banner. They automatically have artificer armor which is awesome and super-expensive. Their biggest drawback is that they get no invuln save so power weapons cut them down and they can fail 3+ saves as fast as the average tactical marine. They can have relic blades!
Yes, the apothecary is really good. This is a great cc unit as well. Not as spendy. You CAN give them all storm shields (maybe you can give those to HG as well. I did not look at my codex).
I have wanted to try bike-mounted command squads, and I will, when my bike army is built!
Once a Marine, always a Marine.
Lol, they hard to fail a 3+ save when you have a 2+.They automatically have artificer armor which is awesome and super-expensive. Their biggest drawback is that they get no invuln save so power weapons cut them down and they can fail 3+ saves as fast as the average tactical marine.
power armour = 3+save, no inulnerable save,
artificer armour = 2+ save, no invulnerable save,
terminator armour =2+ save, 5+ invulnerable save,
combat shield = 6+ invulnerable save,
storm shield = 3+ invulnerable save.
Jager bombs. Very efficient at wiping out friend or foe.
No Honor Guard experience, but Command Squads are amazing units and I include them on all my lists from 750 points up.
I use them close combat oriented, with Company Champion, power weapons and a single power fist, mounted on a Razorback with my Captain, but they can be tailored to almost anything you need it. You could have a unit with 2, 3 or even 4 meltas with melta bombs and start popping every single tank around. If you really want to insult your opponent, take bikes for extra mobility.
The Apothecary is great. Heck, FNP is awesome. I wish I could buy them as an upgrade option for every squad.
In my current 1500 list i use a command squad commonly fitted with a Razorback and a few CC upgrades making the points range from about 180-230pts.
now to get a 5man squad of HG in a razor would put you at around 230 minimum but they all have artificer armor, power weapons and the rest of the standard gear so they are OK at 24" and are also fitted for CC aswell. Unfortunately they dont have FnP or any ranged weapon upgrade except for the grenade launcher.
This makes the command squad the choice of you want a particularly nasty shooting squad with a little bit of an edge in combat. but for pure nasty CC power (24 power weapon hits on the charge) i would take them. you also are able to take up to ten instead of being limited to 5
"There is a fine line between genius and insanity"
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I have sadly passed that line o.0?