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From what I've read on these forums it seems everyone is favoring Autocannons; I plan on taking a lot of autocannons, 9 in HWS and 3 on my 3 sentinels.
My question is.. could 9 Lascannon's spread into 3 HWS with vox and Bring It Down! be as effective as I imagine them? Or would I need a commissar near them for the leadership bonus?
I don't have the codex or rulebook right now but used to play warhammer, forgive me and if anybody could clear up what i need to do in order to increase the HWS leadership it would be greatly appreciated.
I can't imagine 9 twin linked lascannons doing too badly, most armies i will be facing will most likely be chaos or space marines.. lets face it.. everyone plays the two.. so unless they have land raiders the lascannons are fine on armor 13 and lower. If i find myself going up against lots of armor 14 in tournaments i'l take a chimelta squad or possibly a devil dog.
And finally my last question is on heavy bolters.. theyre not too effective against marines so i never liked them too much.. I have quite a few and will have some extras so was wondering is it better to take them in my squads? take them in HWS or just leave them out alltogether?.
Also if i take plasma guns in my squad does it take up the heavy weapons slot? how many plasma guns can i take? (plasma is godly against power armor)
Last edited by generalaz; January 16th, 2010 at 10:21.
Lascannons are quite good in HWS squads. The only problem is that they are a bit fragile to say the least, and they cost a lot of points. Lord Commissars are needed (or Jarren Kell) to help them recieve orders.
On your other question, plasma guns are special weapons
So that means that a Veteran squad can have three of them. This actually works rather well with a lascannon and 'forward sentries'.
1. Autocannons can deal with both troops and vehicles up to AV12. I don't favor HWSs, as they cost quite a bit of points and can be easily taken out. I prefer to spread my HWTs throught my list, from platoons to vehicles. A commissar/lord will help with the HWS's LD, but still the option is too easily blown off the field.
2. I have vet squads which carry a HB/ a sniper/ and have the Forward Sentries doctrines. They do pretty well ... as long as I can keep the 'heat' off them.
3. Plasma guns are special weapons, and the squads entry will tell you how many you can have ( each squad is different ).
Lascannon HWS are expensive and can't get voxes, they require another expensive HQ to make them good for orders. Stick them in infantry units or on Vendettas where they get reliable TL for cheap.
Autocannons are cheap, versatile, and pretty much do the same things as lascannons only better for a lower price.
HBs are meh, ok against infantry but not very versatile. Lengthen the barrels of them and turn into autocannons.
I'm a bit late to the party, but maybe I can shed some additional light on the lascannon vs autocannon debate.
The first thing about guard and lascannons is one shot at BS 3. Twinlinking helps this a lot (75% chance to hit vs 50%), as you have observed, which is why the Vendetta is the preferred platform. Vendetta is a fast vehicle, which can scout, deepstrike and carry up to 12 infantry models, and has 3 twinlinked lascannons. All of this for 130 points. HWS can only achieve the TL effect, and only by purchasing a lord commissar and have a successful order given (an order which is only good on MC and vehicles.). Add in the fact that it is not fast or a vehicle and costs 165 points for this combo. To recap, you're paying an extra 35 points for a lot less function.
The second thing is that autocannons out perform lascannons against anything AV 12 or lower and anything with a toughness value. (Heavy 2 vs Heavy 1, cheaper, same range)
Lascannons have a pitiful chance against AV13+ (around 4% for an av14 vehicle kill), for that kind of duty get a melta, demolisher, or one of the lovely str 10 ordinance weapons from the guard armory.
Hopefully this helps you decide.
Thanks for all the replies guys!
I've taken everything into consideration.. will convert my 10 HB's into autocannons.. when I have them. That'll be 19 stationary autocannons and 3 on my sentinels.. I think i'll have enough
that leaves me with 9 lascannons still.. would having 2 HWS of 3 each and a Lord commissar really be a waste? he could be within 6 inches of both of them so they could both reroll misses on vehicles.
Lascannons are better against marines and termies than autocannons arent they?
For the price of the Lord Com and 2 HWS you could field 2 Vendettas and then some. Considering how fragile HWS are, I find lascannons work better in infantry units.
Lascannons would be better against marines and termies if not for cover, the big equalizer that's all over the place now.
AC vs MEQ
2 shots, 1 hit, .83 wounds, .28 kills
LC vs MEQ
1 shot, .5 hit, .42 kills (.21 with cover)
AC vs Termie
2 shots, 1 hit, .83 wounds, .13 kills
LC vs Termie
1 shot, .5 hit, .42 wounds, .28 kills in the open (5+ invulnerable), .21 w/ cover, .14 w/ storm shields (3+ invulnerable)
As you can see, with cover in the mix they perform very similarly, but the autocannon is cheaper. Weight of fire is your friend with cover the way it is, forcing your opponent to make more and more saves will see him fail more and more.
If MEQ in cover is something you worry about, colossus mortars are your friend. Str 6, AP3, and ignores cover. But as =Me= mentioned volume of fire will bring anything down. One thing you should always remember in your list design is that, IG do numbers better than just about anyone.
IronWeevil is spot on. Quantity will generally beat quality. Imperial Guard work by churning out masses of gunfire, with enough shots to inflict damage, and enough numbers to take return fire. It's not just your guns you need to be concerned with, it's your opponent's as well. If you have the numbers, then you will feel damage a lot less.