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I swear i've heard this argument else where but i can't seem to be able to find it.... so if you don't mind i'll bring it up again in a slightly new light....
In the light of the new and nasty space wolf assult abilities where do full drop pod lists stand against the likes of normal mech? to my untrained eyes it looks rather simple:-
- can target specific squads without having to travel towards them first
- no risk of being destroyed in transit
- can land on and driectly challenge objectives
- really mess up someones lines removing the threat of fire teams (read lootas), tanks and other threats immediatly by putting them in combat with e.g. a group of nasty GHs
- allow you to really dictate the game
- can be used in the taxi cab fashion driving anywhere AND be jumped into again
- a little easy to destroy
The only problem with podding i can see is the seeming inability to use devies/long fangs as effectively as you'd be able to with a 'mixed' mech/ balanced force leaving modeling choices and such a little limited (GHs, WG maybe BCs).
Anyway it'd be greatly appreciated if i could get a few views on the above argument and/or suggestions on the use of podding units/which units to use ( and yes i've read forged's drop pod tactica (very useful ))
all the best
The problem i've found with drop pods is grey hunters work better in rhino's and the fact that your marines are in rhino's means they wont be able to support your other drop pods. A good answer to this is using 2 squads of terminators in drop pods and a dreadnoguht in pod. The 2 terminator squads come down turn 1 and reak havok whilst the grey hunters slip by ans suddenly they are caught in a viking shaped sandwhich. However, when using this tactic do NOT drop the terminators dead centre.Drop them down on a flank so they are fighting a limited number of enemy units and can't get swamped then roll up the flank using multi assault rules. Rune priest work well in these units.
So, in conclusion, I think complete drop pod armies are not viable because of their lack of manouverability after the drop and there vunerability to counter assaults but they can be used as an addition to a rhino rush army(which is the way to go)
You mentioned quick redeployment as (the most important) advantage of rhinos / razorbacks, but you forgot to mention "easily countered" as (the most important) disadvantage of full-fledged all-out drop pod forces. I loved my drop pod army before the fifth edition gave us drop pod assault, effectively nerfing drop pod builds. They still work against immobile armies, but you don't see many of those in the fifth edition meta game.
Drop pods rely on dropping next to their target and completely devastating it. After this initial alpha-strike drop pods and the squads therein are relatively (as compared to mechanized squads) useless. This is usually made up for by the power of that alpha-strike, but everyone is mechanized nowadays, meaning the easy answer to drop pods is reserving everything.
You are obliged to bring down half (rounded up) of your pods on turn one, but your opponent's units won't arrive before turn two. If you have to go first it is even worse, because your first reserves will have no targets either. Thus you are forced to drop into emptiness, either concentrating your forces and castling up, to be easily avoided by the enemy, or spreading out to be destroyed one piece at a time.
Mechanized squads with rhinos / razorbacks can't be forced to be stranded on the wrong side of the field - unless, of course, you destroy the transport, which unfortunately is easy enough. That is why I like bike armies whose mobility can not be stripped. But bikes as troops is not an option for Space Wolves.
What I am saying is: drop pods are very devastating. But if the enemy forces you to drop your units without targets (which is very easy to do thanks to the stupid drop pod assault rule - the current Blood Angel codex doesn't have that yet, so they can still make nasty drop pod armies) drop pods are inferior to even the easily destroyed rhinos / razorbacks. A mix of both does work fine, though, especially since the enemy will be more reluctant to reserve everything the fewer drop pods you have, thus making each individual drop pod more effective the fewer you have, so to speak.
the alpha strike was the primary point i was drawing on, it sounds great on paper but as you've pointed out (and i've now come to realise ) is rather weak in practice and after turn 2 ish. atm i'm thinking of runnin' a compete mix with a plasma GH pack without transport holding objs or running, another 2 GH packs with meltas in rhinos, a long fang pack in RB with HBs, a stationary LF pack with mls and lcs, then a drop pod Wolf lord with suitably nasty cc WG retinue add in a group of scouts walking on with meltas and it's a mess but it should, fingers crossed mess up the opposition. (sorry for all off the abbreviations).
Drawing on the point of the single drop pod... which units are prime candidates for such a transport?
Don't take squads without transports. You can walk them anyway if you really want to, but buy your "stationary long fand squad" and your "GH pack without transport" rhinos or better razorbacks, too. You can even outfit the latter with the more expensive turrets in that case, if you like, as you won't be using it as a transport primarily and can thus remain stationary (in cover) and shoot. You need as many vehicle as you can get, so that your opponent's anti-tank is unable to handle it all, and because they are very cheap but effective. And remember that you can fit any unit into the transport (other than at deployment), so if your dedicated transports die you can use your spare ones instead, etc...
just a quick thank you for the advice and info so far, it's been great and thought provoking, but a quick question, for the above transport additions i'd need to drop a scout squad walking on from a table adge with a melta and pw..... (adding in a tllc rb and a bog standard rhino) worth it?