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So yesterday I went and played at my local store and my opponent was giving me crap about trying to shoot special weapons from the chimera, even though it says "up to 6 models can shoot from the firing hatch." He said I had to use the lasguns, and we got into a big argument about it and it kinda killed the fun of the game.
I'm trying to make the whole army mechanized and I got another chimera; should I put the lasguns in, or just leave the holes empty? Is it illegal to leave them empty, because Id rather just avoid potential future arguments.
Sounds like the guy was just being a sore loser. There really isn't anything to argue about. There is nothing in the rules of a chimera which requires you to use the lasgun ports when using fire points, and for that matter there are only 5 fire points on the vehicle, not 6, so 1 lasgun would go unused. There really isn't any way to avoid an argument like this except show him the codex. If he persists, walk away and don't play him.
"All I know is a door into the dark" -- The Forge, Seamus Heaney
right yes i see where the confusion has come from, in the codex it says;now although that says 5 can fire from the hatch, i have always assumed it means you can only use lasguns when inside a chimera because it also says they fire from the emplacements. however it contradicts itself by saying they fire from the top hatch.Originally Posted by Codex Imperial Guard, 5th Edition, pg.39
to be honest i think you should simply discuss it with your opponent at the beginning of the game and decide on the rules, i think it would be perfectly acceptable to say;those are more or less the rules used in the old codex and i think they make alot more sense to be perfectly honest. but discuss it with your opponent first to save confusionguardsmen may fire lasguns from inside without counting the vehicle as being 'open-topped' or you could choose to fire from the actual hatch but treat it as open-topped.
Delving into the massive rule book the fire points entry:
"... unless specified differently in the vehicles entry, a single pasenger may fire out of a fire point and the other trasported models may not fire. Ranges and line of sight are measured from the fire point itself..."
The codex entry specifies that shots are made from the top hatch not individal fire points. So you can fire 1 weapon from each of the 5 fire points.
I think the main confusion with this is that the chimera used to be setup (last codex) so that passengers could fire the 6 las guns and/or open the hatch to fire other weapons (or more las), whereas now with the new firepoint rules you can just fire any weapons (or powers) from a fire point.
So with the new rules i guess it makes more sense not to add the lasguns to avoid that confusion
in the new codex you do not fire from the lasgun emplacements all shots are taken from the hatch in the back so your oppenent was wrong in this case, the way i deal with people who act like this is i accept there idea's if they really chose not to be swayed then after the game talk about it. if they still refuse your correct explanation then i dont play that person again.
Seriously, people have been firing everything from meltas to lascannons out of Chimeras for a whole year now without any known issue. If GW wanted us to use the lasguns, they would have FAQed it by now.Personally, I've been converting all my new Chimeras to have actual firing ports instead of the stupid lasguns. Have a look:I'm trying to make the whole army mechanized and I got another chimera; should I put the lasguns in, or just leave the holes empty? Is it illegal to leave them empty, because Id rather just avoid potential future arguments.
the back 40k: Pimpin' My Rides
And part one of my conversion how-to:
the back 40k: Converting Set-Back Chimeras - Part I
While thats how I would interpret the codex, there's this as well from the IG FAQ:Q. How do the lasguns on a Chimera function?A. Each lasgun is a separate Fire Point and aweapon it is equipped with.
passenger may fire through it, except that it will
of course fire a lasgun rather than whatever
Taken from page 2 of the FAQ from here:
I'm pretty sure that FAQ's override codexes so his argument would apply in this case?
I think thats the faq for the old codex.
Yep, that's an outdated FAQ for the old 3rd/4th edition IG codex.
This is the current IG FAQ for the new (2009) codex:
It doesn't mention firing ports on Chimeras at all.