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I'm looking to start a dreadnought blood angels list, fielding two units of 10 deathcompany followed by 4 deathcompany dreadnoughts, 3 elite dreadnoughts and 3 heavy support dreadnoughts
I'm a huge fan of themed lists and was wondering if this could actually work competitively. I'm currently a Nid player and have experienced how big of a pain dreadnoughts can really be (even when there is only one on the board)
At this point i'm just unsure of how effective if at all a list ran like this could be and don't particularly want to throw down that kind of money without knowing what I'm getting into
Anyone have any advice for me?
So for competative play I would need to drop from 10 dreads to 9 and run some troops in pods. Still think it would work competatively?
Now, now, let's not be hasty. In any other army, trying to build a list where there are no scoring units would be madness, but this is BLOOD ANGELS! and I would not want to be on the receiving end of an all DC / Dreadnought army, no matter how effective at holding objectives I was.
If you want more than 1 Death Company unit, you'll need Astorath. You'll probably want a stormraven in there to transport one unit, and rhino for another. As for Dreadnoughts, I would divide them up like so:
Frag Cannon Furioso
Standard Furioso (with Heavy Flamer)
Death Company Dreadnought: Blood Talons
DC Dread: Blood Talons
DC Dread: Blood Talons
DC Dread: Standard
Dreadnought: TL-Lascannon, ML
Dreadnought: TL-Lascannon, CCW, Heavy Flamer
Dreadnought: Multi-Melta, CCW, Heavy Flamer
Basically, get a Libby dread in the list. Frag Cannon dreads just seem cool. Putting down 3 templates on an enemy unit is just mean/awesome/great/the most fun you can have outside those insane 4 flamer IG squads. A standard furioso is good for heavy lifting jobs (AV14 stuff). Blood Talons dreads are generally great for killing lots of infantry. One standard one would be fun too. A rampaging dread is hilarious (for humor, imagine zoidberg, then pretend he's a dreadnought).
The normal dreadnoughts I would use for ranged anti-tank.
Now, some of these things you'll probably have to scale back at lower point levels, but heck, it'll be fun. Not to mention, your opponent is going to be so angry having to punch through that many dreadnoughts. Also, drop pods. You'll want drop pods for most of the dreadnoughts. Unless encroaching walls of invincible walking mecha is your thing (and it should be, seriously, who wouldn't piss themselves seeing ten dreadnoughts slowly making their way towards them in a wall of armor).
For tournaments though, yeah, not having scoring units is gonna hurt, unless you play this list and find out it actually is awesome and does table people.
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The only way you're going to win games is by tabling your opponent. I mean really tabling him, which is hard because there's a limited number of turns to do it in. Mobility is also an issue; highly mobile enemies will simply avoid you to stay alive and contest objectives in the last turn only.
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In fighting competitively, I'd say no, as you don't have "scoring" units. It will also depend on where you will be playing. If the bugger running the show created lots of rules, you'll more than likely get screwed.
As ze_poodle said, mobile forces will just stay away from your units. Grabbing objectives in the final turn, and pick off your units ( it's not that hard to down a dread ).
You will need to take, Astorath the Grim, in order to field more than one death company. That being said, the force/models you chosen are highly expensive in points. Points for additional death company cost twice as more than a standard marine, and each dread will be 100+ themselves.
I see little of a chance of pulling this off at 2000pts, but if you do I don't see you ending up with the upgrades you want.
In all honesty, I was thinking the same thing. I tend to love dreads and chaplains, and was disappointed there was only a librarian one.
In agreeing with LastDinosaur , assault squads would make a nice addition. Normal troops have a chance to succumb to the Red Thirst, especially when Astorath is around ...
I'd still say go for it, just be mindful of what you want and the effectiveness your force won't have.
Don't really know what point size you're aiming for, but I'd remove at least two DC dreads and one of the DCs (so you don't have to field Astorath that won't have a squad to join as he's the only one with Jump Packs unless you intended JPDC which makes this list ~3k?).
Then I'd fill in 3 small assault squads (I'd take them in razors).
Something like this:
Reclusiarch (for the DC as he gives them a colossal bonus on the charge)
11man strong Death Company/1 Powerfist/Redeemer with Multimelta
3*5 Assault Marines/1 meltagun/Razorback(HB or HF)
2 DC dreads
3 Dreadnoughst with 2 TLAC
This amounts 2k exactly, and have a fairly large amount of dreads, don't like the redeemer there, but you need 10 DCs for the two dreads and they're just soo much better with chaplain/reclusiarch thus the need.
I don't know how I feel about this list, I'd never field it myself. I feel it'd be much more competitively with much less dreadnoughts, but as that was the whole point so be it. If you aim for higher point games then droppodding mightn't be such a bad idea.
Edit: the more I think about it the less I like the list I proposed.. But still can't come up with anything better that includes a ridicolous amount of dreads. Problem is that DC is a melee unit and so are most of the dreads.. And the dreads will be running across the table unless droppod'ed but you don't really have the points to drop pod all of them.
Get rid of the DC and the DC dreads altogether and you're much better off and have more freedom with the list. 6 dreads are still alot, though if it comes down to this you might prefer to use the standard space marine codex just to get Vulkan.
Last edited by LastDinosaur; May 5th, 2010 at 14:32.
I do suppose I could still run a full dread/dc list without any scoring units in a tourney. I tied first in the last one with 2-win 2-tie 0-losses and all the objectives were contested even without a scoring unit of mine on them.
I was thinking of doing attack bikes or land speeders for fast attack support as well if it turns out that just dreadnoughts cant preform the way I want.
I'm looking at a list ranging from 1500-2000 points here, Usually what we play for both tournaments and fun games
My next question I guess would be which dreadnought models to buy/how many of them and what models come with what weapons?
I just played against a BA dread list and got TABLED bad. As far as competitive goes yes it's brutal. He fielded Mephiston and 9 dreads (3 furioso, 2 autocannoned and 4 death company with the lightning claw like deals). Then he had a 20 man squad of death company. He purposely didn't put any scoring units in it because he felt it was overpowered and forced him to table someone to win.
Well let's just say it worked...I'd also argue this list's difficulty could deny you friendly games...but in a tourny it would be devastating.
Last edited by Dark Trainer; May 6th, 2010 at 03:06.
"There is only do, or do not. There is no try." - Yoda
As I said the bare minimum for what you listed in the first post costs 1810 pts.. And you need upgrades for most of it to make the slightest sense.. So if you really want to go that Dreadnought heavy you won't have the points to fit neither speeders nor attack bikes.
The armament of the dreads depends alot on the list. If you're droppod then multimeltas are worth considering (AoBR dreads). However if you intend to slog it then the double autocannons work well for knocking down transport from afar (sadly only forgeworld or homeconverted autocannons).
The furiosos and DC dreads are limited to close combat weapons, I'd suggest a mix, blood talons are brutal against infantry. If you take normal DCCWs though on the furioso you might want to consider frag cannons. Frag cannons need to be converted, but noone know how they look so just make something up, talons aswell but given the ones shown in codex it shouldn't be too rough to make them either.
Unless you give a more clear impression of what you intend to field I dont think I can help you much further. Also even if tabling is a possibility I dont think it's a reliable one, and if your aim is a draw then you haven't set your mind competitively enough in the first place..
Yeah I suppose it's possible.. What point range was it though?
I'm still quite confident though that unless I'm really unlucky I won't get tabled by a dreadnought list..