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I have found myself very intrested in Dark Angels lately,
Especially their fluff and background.
So i checked on the DA codex cause i am planning to start an army of them.
but... what the hell!?
in comparison to the vanilla marines they are SO overpriced in like everything!
land speeders are more expensive, plasma weapons are more expensive, HQ units have lower stats (but are more expensive atleast) Storm Shields follow the old SM 4e rules, etc...
the only thing that i have found quite usefull and with a chance of possible succes on the TT are Deathwing and Ravenwing company. but the rest... myeh...
now, i find the DA realy cool and stuff and i like the models and colour shemes, but the DA codex just makes you feel like you just bought a XL cup of coffee at Starbucks and the guy behind you is 1000th costumer or whatever and gets his for free.
so, any good ideas what to do with the DA codex?
or just take DA models and play with vanilla marines 5e codex?
double post ftl
Last edited by WhiteRussian; June 7th, 2010 at 12:08.
Agreed. Wolves and Blood Angels have new codex books, i would have thought the Dark Angels will get some attention soon. Normal codex will at least let you use them competitively for now.
Jager bombs. Very efficient at wiping out friend or foe.
I would disagree they're useless. I've seen some very strong Razorback gunline lists, which you can do with Vanilla Marines but DAs have some pluses they don't. I also saw a very good assault army using Azrael, I could dig it up I'm sure.
They aren't the best army but aren't unplayable either.
When Codex: Dark Angels was released, 40k was going through a period where each Codex was being toned down and finely tuned. Against armies from the same era you get quite nice and balanced games. However, Codex: DA was also the precursor to the latest Codex: Space Marines and some of the new concepts were debuted in that book (Combat Squads, etc).
In time, after new Codex releases, armies have again risen in power (the progression from Codex: SM > SW > BA is particularly noticeable) and this has left Codex: Dark Angels in the dust. All that it is really useful for now is all-Terminator armies (though Codex: SW Loganwing gives it a good run for it's money) and in particular, the Deathwing/Ravenwing combo as you noticed.
All-bike armies, previously the domain of Codex: DA, are now more effective using the Vanilla codex.
In my opinion, the only really viable army (that isn't bested by Vanilla) using the DA rules is a combined Deathwing/Ravenwing force using Belial and Sammael both. Remember that Ravenwing Land Speeders are scoring - this is a huge advantage. Ravenwing bikers also have Scouts and Teleport Homers, meaning you can combine their Scout move with Deathwing Assault for a hugely effective alpha-strike.
I would say DA has the stronger Bike army, scoring Land Speeders is a significant ability. Vanilla has the better fighty HQ but overcoming low scoring numbers wins games. Having a large Outflank portion is very good as well, which Vanilla has to pay a ton of points for. Also lets you Reserve everything and not suffer to much against heavy shooting armies.
A veteran DA player in the area, still keeps kicking butts.
I've also ran a force using the DA codex, and I didn't do that bad. I combine all three "wings" (death/raven,green) in my lists.
The die hard fans can always work around the "creep".
I'm still disagreeing with some points ...
1. Deathwing - There are two ideals that make this unappealing for me.
a. Besides his special rules and options, Belial is pretty lack-luster. He's a terminator with a master crafted weapon, which can be traded out for other gear.
b. There is no effective way to deploy them, IMO. You either start with the force on the board, or cross your fingers when you roll for deep striking.
2. Ravenwing - After reading Red Archer's guide to bike armies, I threw at him the question about how effective a Ravenwing force is. This is what he had to say for himself ...
" Hello LeapingLizard76,
I am afraid I have no good news for you. Ravenwing are supposed to be awesome, but currently they're not.
Ravenwing have many supposed advantages, but in fact Codex: Space Marine bike armies are currently superior. Being fearless is (way) inferior to having combat tactics and they shall know no fear. The scout move is a nice little extra, but not at all required, but Ravenwing lack hidden attack bikes and the best support unit ever: the typhoon landspeeder (at least in its effective version - the 4th edition typhoon launchers, as found in Codex: Dark Angels, is useless). The biggest problem of all is that Ravenwing units are extremely expensive. The chainswords they get instead of the bolt pistols won't do any good at all, and while the teleport homers are actually cool to have, using them more or less requires the use of slower units, compromising your army's speed.
Ravenwing can work. But they require a different playstyle: one less evasion-based and more head-on. Easier to play, in fact, more like standard Space Marine armies, but not quite with as much potential as a Codex: Space Marine bike army. Ravenwing has the advantage of having many units - curse in annihilation, blessing in objective missions. Fearless and scouts work to your advantage the most if you play offensively.
Anyway: with the current codices, Codex: Space Marines bikes are superior to Ravenwing bikes. If you want to start a Ravenwing force, why not play it with Codex: Space Marines rules? It's perfectly valid. "
I must admit, however, Sammael is one BAMF on one sweet ride.
3. Greenwing - This is how I run my DA force. Loaded up on tactical squads, and using dreadnoughts/predators for heavy support.
I got a lot of surprised looks, as my opponents realized I was taking chucks out of their force with DAs.
Just my opinions ( and Red Archer's ) of course.
Last edited by SheBeast76; June 8th, 2010 at 16:49. Reason: typos