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Hey everyone, hope you all are having a great day/night at the time of reading this. To the point though, I am building a White Scars army because I love the fluff and I think a white army is amazing looking and I like painting white so that is kinda a plus. So I really love the vanguard models, but I don't know anyone who uses them cause they say they are over priced, but I have 6 bikers scouts and if I give them a locator beacon and move their scout move, then turbo boost this should put me with 12in of some enemy units in which the second round the vanguard drop in within 6in of the beacon so they don't scatter and then do heroic intervention to ream the enemy with power weapons and thunder hammers and SS. Does anyone use this/seen it used/ or think that this would work?
-The Ruler of the Golden Owl Asrai
hmmm, never seen a White Scars army with Jump Pack equiped marines before, but anyway.
allthough most people use a Drop Pod to give the Vanguard a locator beacon i do think this could work, but i would split the bike squad in 2 smaller squadrons to give you a broader selection of tactical choices, so since your playing a Bike army anyway i would get yourself 4 more Scout bikes (i understand that you are still building your army so this shouldn't be to much of a downer) that way you can field 2 squadrons of 5 bikes, each one counts as Troops and are a scoring unit
also, if your Vanguard shouldn't be available in turn 2 you have lesser risk that your scouts are being shot to pulp since you always have one bike squad "spare".
i personally would go for the Drop Pod but my guess is that your go fully for the mounted assault and won't have any units that are allowed to select a drop pod.
so yes i think that that could work very well if you don't let them turbo boost right infront of the enemy fireing line.
Last edited by Swordcommander; June 24th, 2010 at 11:02.
If you've already got Scout bikes in the list it's probably viable. Just keep in mind that Vanguard are overpriced for what they do, so this trick won't always win the game. And it's a big investment.
Your big problem is that it's conditional on the Scouts surviving and being in the right place. The real value of Heroic Intervention is that it puts support where it's needed mid-game, whereas relying on the beacon bubble means that you'll have to predict where they're needed and put the scouts there.
Last edited by ze_poodle; June 24th, 2010 at 15:07.
The above poster = Totally a member of the Fluff Masters Clan. Click here for fluff pwnage.
Come, sons of LO! Kneel before Poodle!
Mr_Wayne: "Some people believe that the World Eaters do not field any ranged weaponry. Those people often die at a distance."
No, I don't think it's a great tactic. It relies on several factors which are not in your control.
- You have to get first turn, otherwise the enemy will destroy the scouting bikers.
- Even if you get first turn, they have to just hang around near the enemy for 1 turn.
- The enemy can anticipate and plan for where the Vanguard will arrive and move his units accordingly.
Let's assume you try to minimise these weaknesses as much as possible. So you infiltrate them out of sight and use your Scout move to move toward the opponent, but still out of line of sight. Let's also assume you get first turn. So you decide to turbo-boost your bikers towards the enemy target you wish to decimate - hoping that the 3+ Cover Save will keep you safeuntil your Vanguard (hopefully) arrive on Turn 2.
Your enemy now looks at the situation. In his deployment zone, near his favourite unit/vehicle, there are 6 x T5 4+ models with a 3+ Cover save. Next turn, there is a 50% chance some Vanguard will arrive next to them and assault 6". So his options are the following:
- Move any nearby units away from the Scout Bikers. Vanguard who arrive will now be out of assault range and can be shot at.
- Shoot at the Scout Bikers with a Heavy Flamer, which will be killing them on a 4+, because it is S5 AP4 and denies cover saves.
- Use weight of fire to whittle them down.
- Assault the Scout Bikers, who are still only WS3 with a 4+ save. Any half-decent assault unit with a power weapon should be able to do it.
- Tank Shock the Scout Bikers, moving them out of the way and thus causing the Vanguard to land in an unfavourable position.
And that's all if you get the first turn and if the opponent deploys in such a way to let you get close and if the Vanguard arrive on Turn 2. There are just too many variables for this to be a viable tactic.
Hmmmm.....well i still might use the the VG, but just Deep Strike them in and scatter for some fun, I just really love the models and I play more of what I like then wat is effective. My other thought was to take 2 Land Speeder squads or LS Storms to fit the theme of the army because my troops are 3 units of bikes and a tact squad or 2 (depending on points I have to work with).
-The Ruler of the Golden Owl Asrai
I have used it with some good success. The fact you can boost the scouts about each turn means you can get pods and Vanguards exactly where you want them. However, as has been stated, they are vulnerable. I drop a pod in turn one with a dred, does some killing and takes the heat of the scouts then hope your vanguard arrive soon. For a really competative list look to spend your points on other stuff.
Overall though I must agree with Ravendove, dont use it in compedative play, there are too many "if" factors.
The Emperor Protects
IG Best Gen 1st overall of 10 DE 4th overall of 6
Eldar 3rd Overall/Best General of 26--2nd Overall/Best General of 7--1st Overall/Best General of 11
If you are trying to win tournaments, do not take VG unless you are a super-skilled player who can win with non-optimized lists.
However if you want to have fun in your games USE THEM. The scout biker idea can work, just be careful with them and realize it is a big gamble. Putting a few killy units in drop pods (dreads, sternguard) will take the pressure off your scout bikers too.
I really only played one game with vanguard and they were the heroes. First, I brought them in using a locator beacon in a drop pod. I had a chaplain with a jump pack pre-positioned to join them. When they came in they killed a bunch, then hopped around all game and in the end of the last turn scoured the enemy off the only objective that they held.
Once a Marine, always a Marine.