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Standard-Fills needs that I can't easily fill with the rest of my GreyKnights.
Crusader-I like to roll a lot of dice, and because the die gods hate me I like to roll them again!
Redeemer-Kills infantry, Kills tanks, Kills hordes...what is not to like?
Why would I ever take such a stupid point sink?
(Poll question is about your list, not mine...I want to know what you use, leave comments about both what you use and what you think I should take)
So I am looking at 2000 points with 2 dreads, a land raider, 40 GKs (8 psycannons), 4 razorbacks, an inquisitor with another psycannon, and deathcult/crusader squad running around with a techmarine.
I am trying to figure out which raider is better for me, the standard Lascannon variety, or the redeemer. So pros and cons of each:
-Good anti heavy armor-2 TL lascannons can do a mess of damage to heavy tanks.
-Boosted range for its anti armor shots would be the only way to take down other heavy tanks from a ways out.
-Has a split responsibly of shooting things at range while trying to get close to drop off the payload of doom.
-Can be pretty meaningless against a mostly infantry list (one of my normal foes plays horde Orks and another players Daemons).
Redeemer Raider (melta for sure, and maybe psybolts)
-Can dish out punishment to tanks and infantry-Tanks lose to multimelta, and TL psycannons.
-Same range as everything else in the army, loses in a tank duel to long ranged anti tank, loses in a close fight to meltas once it drops off its payload.
-Good from range 8-24" with psycannon/melta, good within that with flamestorms.
-Weapons are possibly too redundant-Flamestorms do the same as the payload, melta/psycannon do the same thing as the other 9 psycannons in the list.
-may cost 5 more poings if psybolts are included.
So which would you include in my list, and if you play a raider which raider do you play.
i said to not take one because they are a huge point sink that most armys can take out fairly well now with all the melta spam. If u do tho (or when i do) take the crusader. Personally i love the mobility of the crusader over the other two. Don't give it psy ammo and with PotMS you can fire all the weapons (unless u have the multi-melta, then u have to choose) and still move the full 12". Best assault tank imho. When u load your deathcults into it, you can get your full benefits from it being an amazing transport and its massive fire power.
It sounds like who already talked your self out of the Redeemer in just reading all the cons you put. Your pros/cons for the redeemer are 2/3
You can only fire one weapon if you move 12" with the crusader-When you move over 6" you cannot shoot defensive weapons and the machine spirit allows you to shoot one extra. That is why you always take the multi-melta; if you move 6" you can shoot that at one tank, and the assault cannon and hurricane bolters at something else.
Really? I thought you could fire defensive weapons no matter how far u move.. ill have to reread that.
Well personally I like the redeemer, it can dig just about any squad out of cover. Combined with a deep striking Librarian with 'the summoning' and give the redeemer a Warp stabilisation field to zip this bad boy over to the other side of the field and annialate an entrenched squad with the flamers, also lets you block los to your librarian, which any survivors then get assaulted by what evers inside it.
Other than the reason above I tend to choose a land raider depending on what I want to put in it. A large squad of Paladins or Termies then crusador all the way. I'm not a big fan of the hurricane bolters but theyre not bad. I only take a Landraider in large point games and even then its only the one, I've yet to take more than that no matter the point level.
A vehicle using Warp Stabilization Fields counts as moving flat-out. This, combined with the FAQ that if a vehicle is destroyed in it's own turn (by, say, a bad deep strike scatter...) the unit inside is automatically lost, as well as the fact that you can't disembark from a vehicle moving flat-out, or going to be moving flat-out (Valkyrie/Vendetta being the exception due to their special rules), makes that a poor use of a Land Raider. I'm a fan of the Crusader, on the grounds that anything close enough to be flamed is close enough to be charged.
"The sergeant major asked me what my job is. I told him it's to do what I am told. He gave me a medal. I like the Imperial Guard."
"Innocentia Probat Nihil"
I put crusader, meant to do Redeemer.
At any rate, I'd prefer a Storm Raven with hurricane bolters over a regular land raider. It provides a *lot* of firepower, and anyone who tells you their mindstrike missiles are weak are fooling themselves. It *destroys* psykers, and puts a ton of wounds on squads.
The crusader is over-rated. If your close enough to rapid fire, you should have just taken the redeemer to begin with. At the 24 inch range though its just 6 TL bolter shots. At BS 4 with TL thats 5 hits, on MEQ they will score 2.5 wounds and 1.5 will be saved anyways. Therefore, you score a whopping 1 wound per turn on average. By sacrificing a turn from shooting afar, the redeemer will earn back that turn of 1 lost wound and score plenty more. The cost of a redeemer with melta is also the same as a crusader without the upgrade, so you save a few points.
Tau my love! You are back!
This would be a great strategy if it worked, unfortunately the teleport homer reads as "if a grey knight strike squad, interceptor squad or models in terminator armor wish to teleport onto the battlefield via deep strike..." Unfortunately the Land raider is not one of those choices (also there is some debate as to whether or not a summoned unit is a teleporting onto the field; but in this instance that debate is moot).
Otherwise I think I would make a pretty sweet alpha strike list with Mordak, a librarian and a summoned redeemer...