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  1. #1
    Senior Member IbramGaunt's Avatar
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    Tactics Vs. Orks + Chaos?

    Going to be playing orks and chaos seen in a 2v2 game. Two Daemonhunters Vs. Orks and Chaos, 750 points each.

    I thought of deepstriking behind them, then taking them from the front like a pincer movement or something.

    Then I am worried about that Choas might infiltrate. Any ideas?

    I know that their is a possibility of either a Defiler or Dreadnought being used by chaos, or maybe both! Orks might use a Dreadnought too.

    I don't know wheter the Ork guy was kidding with me but he said he has something thats "extinct". What the hell does that mean lol.

    Well any tactical ideas would be appreciated.


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  3. #2
    I am a free man! number6's Avatar
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    What I can say is that, as good as GKs are in close combat, the Orks can really own close combat if they want to. NEVER give them a chance to assault you, those choppas are hella cruel. In fact, don't get into CC with Orks unless you can win right away. Otherwise, it's better to keep your distance as long as possible and kill them off with storm bolter fire. Orks suck at shooting and their armor just isn't that great.

    I would therefore recommend against deepstriking when playing against Orks. Instead, place your troops in open fire lanes and make them come to you. Slaughter 'em with your storm bolters and mop up the remains only when/if they get to you.

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    Senior Member IbramGaunt's Avatar
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    Those Choppas, what so special about them. Is it that they reduce your save to a 4+ or something?

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    I am a free man! number6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IbramGaunt
    Those Choppas, what so special about them. Is it that they reduce your save to a 4+ or something?
    That's it exactly. It may not seem like much on paper, but in reality it is huge.

    Consider how much we pay for our GKs, and how much the Ork player pays for his choppa-armed Ork mob. For 250 points, we can field squad of 9 GKs. For that same 250 pts, the Ork player can lay down a huge mob (25+) of heavily-armed and armored Orks. In a straight combat, even if your GKs get the charge, the Orks will wipe you out. Because of their multiple attacks, and because of those choppas.

    For fun, I've taken a sizable unit of GK Termies -- led by a Grand Master -- against my friend's HQ squad of Ork Nobs. For the same number of points, his retinue was twice as large as mine. And even though I shot him up before charging, and had the initiative, EACH of his nobs had at least two wounds each. So after I killed off several of them, he still had enough left that his return attack killed ALL of my Terminators. Because of their multiple high-strength attacks. And those choppas.

    GKs, and especially Terminators, rely on those armor saves. That's part of what we're spending all those points on. When those saves aren't there for us, it really really hurts.

  6. #5
    Member Inquisitor Solexus's Avatar
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    "Extinct?" I suppose he might be referring to the Squiggoth, but you should determine whether stuff from Chapter Approved and other non-Codex sources should be used in this game. I've always had trouble with players who go, "Yeah, I know the rules for this, it's in the Chapter Approved book on the shelf there...::rolls dice::...::silence::...yeah, four of your Grey Knights die, no save." That was an Ork Bommer.

    For Infiltrators, ISTs or an =][= with plasma guns and an auspex can make that trick dangerous for your opponent. And because CSM's dont have "And they shall know no fear" once you get a min-maxed squad of Infiltrators under 50% and falling back, they will stay falling back.

    For Ork hordes, a large squad of IST's in a Chimera or Rhino can rush forward and deliver two flamers (three, with a combi bolter-flamer on your Veteran Sgt) along with lots of accurate AP5 shots long before the mobs get within charge range, and choppas don't affect their armor save. Also, remember that Storm Bolters are assault 2. If the Orks get within 12", you can still retreat 6" and fire all of your shots, then charge on your next turn; if they catch you earlier than that, it's probably your own fault . Don't worry about the table edge, GK's are Fearless anyway.

    If you think your Chaos opponent will take a fire suppport role while the Orks charge forward, try fielding a Blessed Dreadnought with TLLC: Bolts of change won't affect it, it can shoot at a Siren Daemon Prince (because it gains the Aegis), and he gets +1 AP against possessed vehicles (such as those using the +1 AV upgrade).
    Last edited by Inquisitor Solexus; October 20th, 2005 at 20:59.
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    Senior Member IbramGaunt's Avatar
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    How do you feel about Deep Striking GK's? Do you think its a neccesity? I was going to have two small squads of GK's or 1 large squad of GK's and a squad of ists with meltas.

    Would you use assassins in a 750 pt game? I was planning on using a callidus but wasn't sure how to use it effectiveley against Orks + Chaos.

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    Member Inquisitor Solexus's Avatar
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    I'd start your Grey Knights on the table to give them as many chances to shoot as possible; their weapons allow them to maneuver fully without sacrificing much range or firepower.

    As for the Callidus, it's hard NOT to use her effectively. If your opponent takes a Defiler, use her "A Word In Your Ear" power to move it within range of your lascannon. If not, mess with the Chaos player's Infiltrators or heavy weapon squads. Do NOT use her against Orks; even with her template weapon, if she charges the number of return attacks from a big mob will flatten her. On the other hand, squads of Chaos Space Marines are manageably small and lets your Callidus use both her weapons to beat their 3+ save.

    If you use the Callidus, though, you probably won't have room for much else. Make sure your partner fields some armor.
    "HQ, my LOS is blocked by a soda bottle. I'm moving to unmask my guns."
    "Negative! The soda bottle is the Carnifex!"
    "Dang proxy models!"
    -Cmdr. Kren, www.tsoalr.com

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    Senior Member DarkKnight's Avatar
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    I personally would leave the Callidus at home, since you are playing a smaller poitn game and those poits would probably be used better beefing ur your GKs.
    "Ah, but the truth is like an expensive whore, Jerek. She comes in many dresses and will bend over for any with the money to pamper her." ~ Konrad von Carstein

  10. #9
    Son of LO ze_poodle's Avatar
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    The thing you should remember is that Grey Knights are very good at both assaulting and shooting, but not excellent at either - well, maybe assaulting. If you are playing, for example, Tau, you would assault as soon as possible, because it's Tau. With Orks, as is your case, the best bet is to take the other option.

    As many psycannons as you can possibly field, ever.

    Seriously. Psycannons will tear through Orks like a shotgun blast goes through rice paper. It's a three-shot Assault with 18'' range. It's AP4 and it wounds Orks on a 2+. Purgation squads see just about their only real use here, since that's twelve shots every round. That's about roughly six dead, and you can shoot at least twice before getting into melee.

    Use that retreat-shoot-retreat tactic mentioned earlier if you find yourself in danger of being charged by a mob, since you do not want to be charged by a mob. One advantage you have is that Chaos can't use its daemons to their full power because...you're Daemonhunters, that's why.

  11. #10
    Member Inquisitor Solexus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ze_poodle
    The thing you should remember is that Grey Knights are very good at both assaulting and shooting, but not excellent at either - well, maybe assaulting.
    I agree completely. The same points value of normal SM's will put out twice as many shots at close range and have a much wider selection of special/heavy weapons. Just two things with Grey Knights vs Orks:

    -Whittle ork hordes down to a manageable size before they get close.
    -CHARGE THEM. DON'T let them charge you. Despite all your firepower, they'll probably get close enough to charge, so don't just let them WAAAGH! and double their Initiative. Fire the SB's, Psycannon and Incinterators and go in swinging (chopping, slicing, smiting, etc.). You'll hit and wound easily and Ork Boyz tend to have S3-4, I2 and mere 6+ saves. If you get a mob down to 10-12 models, you can reduce it to 1-3 in one turn with only 5 GK's shooting and assaulting. With that few return attacks, your squad should be relatively safe.
    "HQ, my LOS is blocked by a soda bottle. I'm moving to unmask my guns."
    "Negative! The soda bottle is the Carnifex!"
    "Dang proxy models!"
    -Cmdr. Kren, www.tsoalr.com

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