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Basically, for 20 pts a squad can roll 3 dice instead of 2 and pick which 2 he wants when performing a faith test.
Depending on which power/squad size you use you may not be sure if it's a good idea to roll or not. Well, here is the probabilites for each value (cumulative).
This is going to be a mess but I'll explain what it means.
Value # ways to get HIGHEST(3 dice) Cum Prob 2 dice Cum
2 1 0.46% 2.78%
3 3 1.85% 8.33%
4 7 5.09% 16.67%
5 12 10.65% 27.78%
6 19 19.44% 41.67%
7 27 31.94% 58.33%
8 34 47.69% 72.22%
9 36 64.35% 83.33%
10 34 80.09% 91.67%
11 27 92.59% 97.22%
12 16 100.00% 100.00%
Value # ways to get LOWEST(3 dice) Cum Prob 2 dice Cum
16 7.41% 2.78%
27 19.91% 8.33%
34 35.65% 16.67%
36 52.31% 27.78%
34 68.06% 41.67%
27 80.56% 58.33%
19 89.35% 72.22%
12 94.91% 83.33%
7 98.15% 91.67%
3 99.54% 97.22%
1 100.00% 100.00%
Let's say you were using a power which required to roll equal to or OVER your squad size. For a squad of 7 let's say. Rolling 2 dice you would have a 58% of succeeding. However if you were rolling 3 dice you would have a 1 - .195 = 80.5% chance of success. That's an increase of 22%! The numbers are the same for rolling LOWER your squad size (or equal to).
You can do the math for different squad sizes, but the point is that it is well worth spending the 20 points extra for using those nifty powers. A buttload of shots into a SM squad with Divine Guidance is really nice.
Consider Litanies of Faith. For only 25 points you can fire off an Act of Faith with 100% chance of success without using a Faith Point. How about that?
Yeah, but you can only use it ONCE for the entire game, not to mention can only be used by Cannoness and Palantine.
AND their retinue...Originally Posted by Laplace
Imagifers have been carefully costed to be worth it, IF you're using several acts of faith on that unit during the game. Bear in mind that a unit may be destroyed or simply not need to use faith during the game. Also an Imagifer makes little difference to units that use faith when reduced to 3 or so models, or are at 10 models or above, depending on act.
Imagifers also take away from the number of bodies in your squads, which both add firepower and improve DG chances, and increase army resilience. Because of this I've come to the conclusion that Imagifers, like Eviscerators, should not be handed out to everybody just because you can, for all their usefulness. It's simply possible for them to become a point sink if overused. Consider that handing out say five of them would rack up to 100pts, and this could easily be done in a 1500pt game.
Imagifers are best in squads like a Celestian retinue, or Seraphim (who come with it included), and possibly Dominions. Minimum size mech Battle Sister squads may also benefit from them, but only if your tactics place a lot of emphasis on them. Since such squads tend to appear in multiples putting an Imagifer on all of them may be expensive.
From my experience a lot of the faith tends to get spent on the Canonesses and Seraphim. With Battle squads I find it better to spend the faith on the ones who are in a condition to use it, such as heavily depleted and stuck in cc with power-weapon maniacs, or shooting at full squad strength. Other squads do the best they can. Since I take at least 3 and up to 5 of these squads this is feasible for me. In general I don't really miss having Imagifers on Battle squads, it's rarely an issue, not enough at least to justify the points drop for it.
Last edited by hs5ias; February 15th, 2006 at 14:58.
Seraphim don't need it as they roll 3 dice anyway as long as they have a verteran.Imagifers are best in squads like a Celestian retinue, or Seraphim (who come with it included), and possibly Dominions. Minimum size mech Battle Sister squads may also benefit from them, but only if your tactics place a lot of emphasis on them. Since such squads tend to appear in multiples putting an Imagifer on all of them may be expensive.
IMO it's good to have one in games at about 2000pts+ but its not entirely vital with basic battle sister squads at 10 at lower than that army size. So i agree with that point that you shouldn't take them just because you can. Averagely sisters should out number space marines and come close to on par with armies like tau, if your sisters start to be out numbered heavily against these armies you should consider to knock off some wargear.
i dont use imagifiers simply cuz its too many points and i'ld rather have more sisters
2000pts Orks 4-2-1
yep it aint worth 20 points thats almost a whole 2 sisters and in the end that is a much better option.
"take my love, take my land, take me to where i cannot stand, i don't care i'm still free you can't take the sky from meee" ;- firefly
"i'm gonna grant you your greatest wish i'm gonna show you a world without sin" ;- serentiy
"I am a leaf on the wind, watch how i soar" ;- serenity
No disrespect intended, but I disagree with this premise fairly strongly.
My chief reason is that I find I am able to maintain my squad size in such a way that it maximizes their potential for a successful passage of faith, without any problem.
Most of my faith points are consumed by a Seraphim and Cannoness, who don't need it.
The only faith that my SOBs use is DG or maybe HAND, which doesn't require any help.
Case and point is that that I've failed only 1 faith test in 3 games.
As stated, I think it might be a good idea to sometimes place on with your Celestians, especially if you use them aggressively.