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Everywhere I turn people are praising WGPL's, but I'm just not convinced. I've tried several times to make a list incorporating them into my packs, but I always wind up scrapping them in favor of another entire pack of bc's or gh's. It just seems to me that eight grey hunters with two powerfists and a meltagun outweigh four WG that have basic statlines and powerweapons. You can give them wargear, which is definitely nice, but they quickly wind up costing fifty points or more each, and in the end it just seems like a points-sink. :unsure:
So, my wolfbrethren, show me the light. What am I missing about WGPL's, and how do you equip yours to justify their cost?
- keeps your blood claws from assualting if you are within 6inches if you dont want em to.
- extra powerfist and spec wep in the pack.
- keeps the added firepower and abilities spread out thru the army instead of in one pack that is obvious and easily dealt with.
- gives nice fluff to your army
- cant remember but i do believe they have bette leadership then you average blood claw
anyways just a few advantages off the top of my head
There are two excellent reasons to use pack leaders.
First they are fluffy, it gives the pack a leader instead of being 6-10 random guys who don't have a seargent. Plus it gives each squad one charactor you can really spend some time modeling and he isn't just a normal guy.
Second the are awesome, and cost effective...I personally use lightning claws on mine, but if you want to go the power fist route lets just compare some things. Two powerfisting greyhunters with pistols get 2 attacks each (4 total when you get charged) and cost 64 points. One WGPL with a powerfist and a pistol, and the wolfpelt gets 3 base attacks (4 when you get charged) and only costs 49 points. Oh and he adds one to the leadership of the squad, and increases the maximium size by one; which would help if the rhino could hold 11 people...
Take the Pack leaders, they are awesome, fluffy, cost effective, and ultimately they give each pack a special charactor feel, which is ultimately why anyone plays space wolves right--not for thier greatness, but for their charactor.
I agree 100%. In fact I already have them painted up and ready to go, but my concerns over their value has me letting them take turns as WGBLs rather than using them as WGPLs.First they are fluffy, it gives the pack a leader instead of being 6-10 random guys who don't have a seargent. Plus it gives each squad one charactor you can really spend some time modeling and he isn't just a normal guy.The two GH have an extra wound and on the charge get 6 attacks rather than 4.Two powerfisting greyhunters with pistols get 2 attacks each (4 total when you get charged) and cost 64 points. One WGPL with a powerfist and a pistol, and the wolfpelt gets 3 base attacks (4 when you get charged) and only costs 49 points. Oh and he adds one to the leadership of the squad, and increases the maximium size by one; which would help if the rhino could hold 11 people...
If you expand on this idea that roughly 1 WGPL = 2 GHs then 4 WGPL = 8 GHs. Eight Grey Hunters are an extra unit to hold objectives, which is a major advantage that four WGPLs can't give you.
That said, I really want to play them for the fluff reasons and I suppose it can't hurt too badly to give them a shot. I'm just hoping someone will point out something I can really latch onto as a tactical reason to use them. I've been thinking about it this morning quite a bit and the best I can come up with is that if you include a WGPL armed with a wolf tooth necklace in a blood claw squad he gives them a better chance against high ws opponents... yeah, that's the ticket!
EDIT: On a side note, am I the only one that really wishes these guys could purchase frost weapons?
I just take them in Blood Claw bike squads to bulk out the powerfists and in the wolf scouts to get a power fist. For everything else, I'd rather blow the points on more blood claws.
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I think the main benifit of Pack Leaders is that you get to squeeze one more Power Weapon or Power Fist into the pack. And the better leadership is good also.
But I am not sure a Pack Leader stops the Blood Claws from charging.
I must admit I always thot it did. Until just a few days ago.
The Head-Strong rule actually says they don't have to charge when led by an Independant Character.
I.E. A Wolf Lord joins the BC pack.
A WGPL is NOT an IC !!
darn Darn DARN!! (
Just for comparison:
10 GH with 2 PW is 200pts
9 GH with 2 PW and a WGPL with PW is 222 points.
So, same number of guys, 1 extra PW with an extra attack for that PW and 1 better Leadership for 12 points.
If ya figure ya gotta pay the same for the PW no matter who gets it.
Yea, I think that's worth it :yes:
Fear the Wolf !!
I have just started on the wolfes and from what I have read the WGPL is worth it in BCs but am not so sure with the GH I suppose it will depend what you use the pack for if its for CC then ye I think the pack leader would be useful but not as an extra in a firesupport. so I think I will only be incuding WGPL in my Bloodclaws.
Offtipic a bit but does anyone have a pic of a coverted SM vet as a WGPL or do you use the normal models if there are any?
Yes people i know that my spelling and punctuation is awful but I am product of British teaching pollicies so what can I do about it?
First of all what do you arm them with?
Mine have the same weapons as the squads they're in, so either power weapon or power fist. Also having a wolf tooth necklace is a must with these guys. It worth the look on your opponents face when you say 'I need threes to hit then twos to kill your chaos lord of uber death'
The extra leadership is another upside, taking the squads to leadership 9, very important for drawn out combats
Only a few prefer liberty - the majority seek nothing more than fair masters
On the fluff side, you gotto love WGPLs. No need to work out on that, I think everybody here knows and understands.
On the practical side, indeed, WGPL are horribly expensive when kitted out well. They will certainly do their jobs with impressive quality, but as JohnPublic pointed out, it is very tempting to take another pack of GH or BC instead.
They are an investment.
Personally I'd probably only take them in 3 situations:
- I just want a WG in there, no matter what. I want that grizzled veteran chopping up my opponents. He grinning in his beard, I chuckling with the dice in my hand.
- I happen to have a big pack of BCs without an available IC to join them and I want them to hold ground in drawn out combats or my opponent is manoeuverably superior.
- There is a podding pack of GH which I expect to get into serious trouble. A WGPL with strengthen their backs.
If I'd invest in a WGPL I'd do it good. Wolf Tooth Necklace and a pair of lightning claws.
I think Strava may have hit it on the head. This entire time while considering WGPLs I have been weighing the point cost of a squad against that same squad with a WGPL added onto it. What I really should be weighing is the point cost of the squad against that same squad, minus a member, with a WGPL added onto it. I'm not sure if that makes a whole lot of sense to everyone, but to me it lessens my perception of their cost.Ok, so they can't keep my BCs from charging, but the day I am within 6" of an opponent with bloodthirsty bloodclaws and don't charge him with 40+ attacks is the day I put down my fluffy chainsword. Also, not being an IC you can say 'I need threes to hit then twos to kill your chaos lord of uber death and you have to kill 8 power armored marines before you can stop me'A WGPL is NOT an IC !!
darn Darn DARN!!
At any rate I think I'll start including a few into my BCs regularly and if at some point I don't think they are pulling their weight they'll be downgraded back to lowly battle leaders. :tongue: Time will tell.