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In 2nd ed psykers ruled, now they suck.
In 3d ed Rhinos dominated the game. Now they are degraded to excellent models which stay on the shelf (sob)
Now the Drop Pods (DP) rule.
GW wanted to make the space marines list more balanced. It is'nt. DPs are to good!
The rhino would still be a valid choice for transportation if DPs were more balanced.
My question is if any SM palyer who wants to get into CC can afford not to use DPs instead of Rhinos or other forms of transportation.
Capacity: Rhino holds ten regular marines or scouts, DP holds ten marines, 5 termies or 1 dread.
Movement: DP much more efficient at getting troops into CC than either teleportation or the Rhino.
Weapons: DP as good/bad as Rhino (not counting HK miss)
Cost: Standard Rhino **p (smoke and armour) DP **p [Edit by Chaosbrynn: you should know better then to post point values]
Block LOS: Tied. Rhinos can move while DPs are stationary. Since GW dont give out measurements for DPs some people go wild and use DPs with the diameter of CD-casings (almost as large as a land raider).
I fear that DP-assault is the new Rhino Rush...
Last edited by Chaosbrynn; December 21st, 2005 at 15:24.
they aren't too good...hell there not much of a better choice than rhinos.
for a start your squads could land way behind enemy lines, unsupported and horribly vulnerable to bum-numbing amouts of firepower
they dont arrive when you want them to
you can't have hkm's on them...sure they miss alot, but with a strength 8 unlimited range missile, the enemy cant rely on the fact that your marines are squinty forcing them to hide stuff
i havn't used drop pods and i've played marines for 5 bloody years lol
Never judge someone until you've walked a mile in their shoes...by that time they'll be a mile away, and have no shoes
Regarding the huge drop pods, as far as I can tell the Forge World models are actually about that size. Slightly smaller, but not much. In all fairness, I'm just trying to guess based off of the Marine model in the picture.
If you think about it, a drop pod would have to be larger than a rhino, since there is no way a dreadnaught is fitting inside one of them. So it must be taller. And it can take terminators as well, something a rhino cannot, so I assume it has more space for them inside. Somewhere inbetween rhino and land raider size, I would guess, although I have to agree ones the size of a land raider are just a bit stupid.
Drop Pods are indeed better then rhinos.
And they can be excellent mediums for a Marine Commander who knows how to use them and has a list/chapter that fits well with them.
Are they too good?
I dont think so. Sure properlly built drop pod armies are incredibly effective to the point that ive been thinking about buying 10 forge world drop pods for an army. But not every space marine list should incorporate them and not every player should use them. It really depends on the make up of your list. Assault terminators for instance, are no better off in a pod, you can still run away from them for the entire game. Plasma cannons can still put the hurt on squads that pop out (although you need more then just 1 in a list as you need to be able to cover both sides of the pod) and it does have a weakness to exploit, the fact that you still must remain stationary for a turn.
Are they better then rhinos, hell yes.
Are they too good, I dont think so.
Do they need to release plastic models? HELL YES!
Mentor of Space Marine Commanders far and wide.
Efficiency VS Point Cost VS Ease Of Use - Your best bets:
1) Chaplain led Assault squad - 2 plasma pistols, powerfisted sergeant
2) 8 man Devastator squad - 4 missile launchers
3) Land Speeder Tornado - HB + AC
I'm going to have to agree with you on this one Ikterus. Drop pods are obviously the best method to transport troops into combat. As far as I'm concerned anytime one option is obviously better than another option whose function is the same, then there is unbalance. If there is unbalance then one of the options is either too weak or one of them is too strong, in this case I think it is clear that the drop pod is too strong. I would really like to see the drop pod rules changed in one way or another to lessen their effectiveness. "But why?," you ask, "don't you play space wolves?" Yes, I do, but at the moment I am beginning to feel that to be competitive with other marine armies I should be incorporating drop pods into my lists.
IMO Drop pods can be very good, but not that good either. Depending on both your army and the dice gods.
Armies like Salamanders and Space Wolves (Grey Hunters) have great benefit by Drop pods. It just fits their style ingame.
And on the last point, it's fantastic to have your whole army podding in together on turn 2, but on the other hand it can all go wrong too.
Podding is a risky business, but for some armies the potential benefits are just greater than the potential risks.
I don't think there's anything wrong with Drop pods.
Hmm, the question is spun (unintentionally I am sure), are drop pods that arive safely at a point on the battlefield as good as rhinos which have to drive all the way over from your deployment zone under fire, at delivering troops to a specific point on the battlefiedl?
that is rather like asking what is better at being an orange fruit, an apple or an orange?
Rhinos give you other options which are well outside the remit of drop pods, not only the stuff they can do by themselves, which most people pick up on, also the ability to move troops after they got out by getting back in again, but also the one usually missed, if you want to take a pred or vindi, if you use drop pods you are likely to get these 2 tanks shot to bits cos they are the only vehicle on the field at the time, wheras with a massed set of vehicles, you are forcing him to make choices, which can be made very wrongly
Everything you have been told is a lie!
So, no body has a problem with infilrating every tactical marine, command squad, veteran squad, scout squad, and devistator squad, in your entire army, where ever you want to go on the board, AFTER your opponent has completely deployed. If you want something to compare to a rihno rush, pick that, as its cheaper, better, and it offerse the CHANCE of a frist turn charge, although, what ever opponent would move twards you to allow such a charge, would probably pretty monsterus in CC. And besides that, marines need something the counter demon summing rules, which are completly unfair.
That'll be the assault cannon, then (Chaos has disadvantages...).Originally Posted by ForgedInTheFurnaceOfWar
Drop pods aren't quite the cheesy terror they make out. They are an excellent choice for dreadnoughts, particularly in escalation missions.
Drop pod heavy armies tend to fall foul of one of two things (or both): the random nature of reserve rolls and enemy strategy.
The first point is fairly obvious - if it turns up in drips and drabs, you're doomed.
The 2nd point is slightly more involved. Drop pod heavy/all drop pod armies can be strange to play against at first. You have no idea where it will turn up, and it will always be able to respond to what you do in your first (and sometimes second) turn(s).
Some players in the face of it spread their armies out to counter any possible threat, and that is when they usually lose. By spreading out, the drop pod army can pick a point and effectively "roll" up the line, or pick off isolated elements. Vehicles tend to get minced as melta gun teams drop in next door and crack open their side armour. It chops off your arms so you can't fight back.
It can be an intimidating experience.
That's where strategy comes in. A tight deployment does not allow a drop pod force to attack weak points in the line - while it will still cause some pain, the drop pod units cannot run amok since the enemy can respond immediately to any threat with enough firepower. It turns the army on its head as often drop pod units can become isolated. By forcing them to attack the body of the army, you can more adequately resist any damage it does.
This has the effect of forcing the drop pods to respond to your strategy, instead of the other way around. Once down, you are effectively playing a marine infantry army. Once that first "drop" turn is out of the way, it becomes much simpler.
At the moment, drop pods and drop pod armies are rare - few people have played with them or against them. To most players as a result they don't know how to deal with it. In my experience against it, it's a "trick" army - once you've worked out how to deal with the trick, you stand an excellent chance of dealing with the army.
Having an army and not owning a rulebook is like owning a car with no steering wheel.Originally Posted by amishcellphone