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Played an interesting 2,000 pt match against an Eldar player yesterday. Despite the fact that he was that Craftworld that had the super snipers and put 2 of my squads in reserve AND got to choose the scenario, I still pulled out a win.
What was interesting was how effective my long range shooting was. True, it is more effective against Eldar than marines, but I still was able to keep him far back and my heavy support dreads were able to keep his skimmers in check.
I then starting comparing costs for long range heavy shooting and realized that the Inq retinue is one of the best buys out there for the job.
Say for example you gave a DH Inquisitor a Psycannon, and had 3 warriors each be Gun-Servs with Heavy Bolters, and have 1 Sage for good measure.
Your total cost for that squad is 135. Not bad considering you have four 36" guns pumping out 12 shots of str 5 or 6, a inq with BS5 (rest is 4), and have 4+ armor.
And since you can have 3 Elite slots you have 3 of these heavy supportish groups. More if you decide to add and Inq Lord.
For Heavy Support you fill it with 3 dreads. And for troops you could go with 2 squads of GK each with 2 psycannons in them.
That base right there gives you 7 psycannons and 9 Heavy bolters.
I throw in an Allied Callidus and a Serpahim squad and I'm on my way to outshooting my opponent.
The problem with =I= squads is that they lack durability. With minimum guys (=I= + 3 warriors) any losses remove HBs. Unless you add at least 3 misc guys you're still removing HB armed troops. Once you add more than 3 other retinue, your unit majority save drops to a whopping 6+.
True, it doesn't have a lot of durability. That's why you need to keep them placed in something that will allow cover saves.Originally Posted by dvang
You can add 1 more misc troop and still keep the majority armor save at 4+ (Acolyte maybe?).
Still, I am still confident that given the number of heavy targets out there, that they will earn their point back fairly easily.
this kind of usage really has more place in a WH army that lacks the ability to create the uber combat monsters that DH can be, but also tends to lack long range fire support. In that case it is effective
Everything you have been told is a lie!
Just so you're aware, allied units take up slots in the same FOC as core units. You only have a total of three Elite slots with which to work, regardless of where the units are coming from.I throw in an Allied Callidus and a Serpahim squad and I'm on my way to outshooting my opponent.
Anyways, I've long been a supporter of shooty Daemonhunters. But I think they work best with inducted IG and few to no GK. Something along the lines of:
1 Inq Lord (shooty)
1-2 Inquisitors (shooty)
1-2 CC Assassins (Callidus or Eversor, and/or 3 Death Cultists, as per your tastes)
2 IST units (meltaguns, rhinos)
0-2 Armored Fists (lascannons or missile launchers, ml/hb on the chimeras)
0-2 Platoons (I'd go with 1 ML & 2 LC's per Platoon, but if you're light on Inquisitor units, a Platoon dedicated to HB's is handy)
0-1 3x Sentinels (autocannon, use for first-turn anti-armor)
0-1 Russ (obvious here)
0-1 Orbital Strike (screw up enemy deployment, force them to move towards you to avoid the OS)
0-2 FAGK (I stand by the idea that GK work best in a fight and that psycannons are too expensive to rely on)
You're right. I keep forgetting that annoying rule. Anyway, have to think about whether to scrap the Callidus or one of my Inq squad.Originally Posted by mEGALOMANIAC
Acolyte's can't buy carapace armor (4+) save. All you could give them is power armor (3+). Sure, then you could, at least for the first few shots, use 3 acolytes in power armor to soak up shots.. but then the unit starts to get a little pricey and it only lasts as long as the acolytes+Inquisitor outnumber the servitors. True, you want to keep these unit in cover... but that's likely only a 5+ unless you find some bunkers. If you only put 2 misc retinue (like 2 sages), by the mixed save rules, then the first hits get allocated to the 3 HB servitors since they have the majority armor save. Unless you change the save (by adding a lot of 6+ save models, or 3 acolytes in power/articifer armor) then your HB servitors are the most likely to die as those models are forced to make the saves before any others.You can add 1 more misc troop and still keep the majority armor save at 4+ (Acolyte maybe?).
I'm not saying a shooty Inquisitor is bad.. it pumps out a lot of shots. All I'm explaining is the main reason behind why most DH players don't take =I= with retinues.
In the revised printing of c:DH, carapace armor *is* in the codex and allowed on Acolytes.Acolyte's can't buy carapace armor (4+) save. All you could give them is power armor (3+).
Last edited by mEGALOMANIAC; January 24th, 2006 at 21:25.
Really? Good. I wondered why it wasn't in there in the first place. Wish they would have put it in the update, though, like bolt pistols.In the revised printing of cH, carapace armor *is* in the codex and allowed on Acolytes.
I have mised maybe, but on wich page are the wargear of the DH with points cost, i found just vehicles.