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  1. #1
    Forward Kommander Blood_Blade's Avatar
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    How Many GK's Can You Fit in 1 Chapter?

    My question is, how many Grey Knights are in the Chapter (roughly). I'm assuming theres more than 1000 as there fighting Chaos across the whole Galaxy! I've heard numbers ranging all over the place and was hoping to get the issue settled in one thread. I searchied the fourm, so if there was a previous thread on this sorry.

    If the numbers could be broken down into ranks it would help with some fluff I'm making for my army (ie # PA GK, # FA GK, # Justicars ect)

    Thanks :yes:

    Quote Originally Posted by MiketehFox View Post
    Ze KHADORANS vill Krush other puny factions into ze Dust! Then vill spread on Sandvich and eat! MMMMMmmmm...

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  3. #2
    LO Zealot Grey's Avatar
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    Interesting. I would tend to agree that being non-standard in all other respects, they wouldn't follow the codex astartes.


    I'd also venture to state that there is more than one grandmaster as stated on page 6 of the codex.

    Here's what we know.

    1 of the grandmasters gets a seat on the Inner Conclave of the Inquisition.

    All grey knights start as battle brothers, move up the ranks to justicars, to brother captains and then finally to grand master.

    Thats about it I think for definate knowledge. Now we get into conjecture. How many battle brothers are there for each Justicar? I'm going to say aproximately 10. What the hell it seems fair. So how many Justicars are there for a Brother Captain? Again, I'm going to guess, but say 10. Ditto for Brother Captains to Grand Masters.

    So....We've got 1 Grandmaster, 10 Brother Captains, 100 Justicars, 1000 Battle Brothers. Seems pretty solid to me. And to keep things symetrical, I'm going to say that there are 10 Grandmasters to the 1 on the Inner Conclave. Giving us...


    1 Inner Conclave Grand Master
    10 Grand Masters
    100 Brother Captains
    1000 Justicars
    10000 Battle Brothers

    So, around 11111 Grey Knights scattered around the galaxy in small groups.

    Well. Thats my guess. .

    I suppose if I went 1 in 10 instead of 1 to 10, it would be:


    1 Inner Conclave Grand Master
    9 Grand Masters
    81 Brother Captains
    729 Justicars
    6561 Battle Brothers


    7381 Grey Knights. Bleah. I like my first answer better.
    Last edited by Grey; January 27th, 2006 at 02:02.
    "No one has a monopoly on wisdom."-S.W.G.

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    Forward Kommander Blood_Blade's Avatar
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    11 111... thats more than my guess, but with the back-up fluff seems about right :w00t:

    Thats a lot of GK!

    Any other interpritations are welcome!
    Quote Originally Posted by MiketehFox View Post
    Ze KHADORANS vill Krush other puny factions into ze Dust! Then vill spread on Sandvich and eat! MMMMMmmmm...

  5. #4
    Son of LO mEGALOMANIAC's Avatar
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    Everything I've heard and read points towards the GK being roughly Legion sized, which is about 10,000 active marines. And Grey's educated guess agrees. So that's what I'd say it is.

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    Though what you guys are saying totally makes sense I think it has to be way less. The Grey Knights are a mostly secret organization and it seems to me that there would be less Grey Knights than that of other chapters. Just for the sake of recruitment 10000 would be unbelieveable, That means that they had to find that many people who were not only space marine quality but space marine HQ quilaity (libriarian). Do you guys really think there are ten times the number of GreyKnights as there are Ultramarines? In fact there would be more GKs than space wolves, ultramarines, blood angels, and dark angels combined if they truely only have 1000 marines per chapter. Now maybe I am all wrong here, but a legion of GKs would be enough for the Imperium to retake the Galaxy if they are tougher than space marines, and space marines are as tough as the fluff says.

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    Member Grandmaster Salem's Avatar
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    I would say there are more GK then normal space marine chapters but I cant believe there are over 10,000 of them. If there was then everyone would know about them. I figure there is probably about 2,000-3,000 knights scattered across the galaxy (we have to remember the galaxy is a big place). Having 2-3,000 individuals in the entire galaxy of humaity is like a drop in the ocean. Also it says in the GK novel that a force of over 200 grey knights assaulted a planet and there were no survivors. A chapter sized force these would have been pretty substantial losses. I think the reason why no one might know about them is the fact that there might not be anyone left after the GK accoplish whatever they came to the planet for in the first place.

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    LO Zealot Grey's Avatar
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    Well, at the risk of starting an argument, I have to say, that since the GK are typically split up into squads of 10, 10,000 spread out that way over the entire galaxy IS but a drop in the ocean.

    When the Ultramarines show up to fight, they announce their presence by appearing in much larger groups than a squad, with heraldry and banners flying, and typically they leave survivors(at least on the imperial side. ) I mean, one of their old pieces of wargear was the Company Banner which caused fear in the enemy because they knew the entire Ultra marine chapter was there to stomp them.

    I was always my impression that when the GKs show up, they either:

    1. Leave none to minimal survivors to prevent contamination and heresy spreading.

    2. Are fighting a daemonic/chaos incursion that has already left no survivors that aren't already chaotic, forcing the GKs to leave...

    3. No, to minimal survivors.

    4. Deployed in an area where the only ones that would see them would be their foes. Who they would attack leaving...

    5. None, to minimal survivors.

    Shrug. Just my two cents, although I take it to heart what you are saying about the difficulty of finding that many potential recruits that are SM worthy and potentially powerful psykers as well. All I can say, is that in the GKs case, they have potentially the entire resources of the entire Imperium to draw upon, while a typical SM chapter has usually only one or a group of planets. (In the case of a crusading chapter like the BTs, they draw upon a larger population base, but are again, larger than standard.) It makes me wonder how/WHO does the GKs recruiting, as secrecy is so important. Maybe a branch of the same part of the Inquisition that mans the Black ships?

    Either way, I don't want to fight too much about this, as there IS no real documentation either way, and indeed, your guess is as good as mine. We're just going off what make sense to any of us. Once again, as you say, in the fluff, SMs are quite a bit:

    1. Rarer.

    2. More powerful.

    From that perspective, yeah. You perhaps don't need 10,000 GKs for them to have an effect. But considering how many armies are played with them now, or who have at least a squad of them along for the ride. Heh. 10,000 might be too few.


    This is probably going to remain an unaswerable question but I doubt that will stop a lot of folks from responding to it. . Hell, I did. Twice even.
    Last edited by Grey; January 27th, 2006 at 11:33.
    "No one has a monopoly on wisdom."-S.W.G.

    Fluff Master Clan initiate.

    "I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones."-A.E.

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  9. #8
    Senior Member Phoenix Guard 1988's Avatar
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    I think that 10,000 is a reasonable number. Think about it, there are several million people living in America alone right now. In 38,000 years, the galactic population will have exploded to hundreds of trillions of people spread over distances so vast that it takes light itself many years to go from one end to the other. If anything, I think that 10,000 might be on the small side to have a force of Grey Knights within striking distance of almost everywhere in the known galaxy in a force big enough to contend with a standard demonic infestation. Add in things like the eye of terror and you can begin to see how much manpower it takes keeping the Imperium free of incursions.

    About keepng them secret, again, in any one place, there will probably be only a small number, probably equaling something on the order of 50-75 at the maximum. If they used the Inquisition "black ships," which aren't secret, to move around, then none would be the wiser, especially as they strike hard and fast, leaving only their dead enemies behind on the battlefield. The codex says that Imperial armies often arrive at the battlefield with the war already won and they have no idea why. It also says that all of the IG that they induct are killed and the marines get mind-scrubbed.

    Just for the sake of recruitment 10000 would be unbelieveable, That means that they had to find that many people who were not only space marine quality but space marine HQ quilaity (libriarian).
    Valid point, but the daemonhunters have had thousands of years and millions of worlds from which to recruit. The Black Templars have a similar organization and they have around the same number as well probably. The Grey Knights have the full use of Imperial resources at their disposal and they probably look at all of the psychic kids that the Inquisition hauls in to see if they can be turned into Grey Knights.
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  10. #9
    LO Zealot XenomarinesKiller's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenix Guard 1988
    Valid point, but the daemonhunters have had thousands of years and millions of worlds from which to recruit. The Black Templars have a similar organization and they have around the same number as well probably. The Grey Knights have the full use of Imperial resources at their disposal and they probably look at all of the psychic kids that the Inquisition hauls in to see if they can be turned into Grey Knights.
    Black Templars, in their full extent, have about 3,000 marines(read this in WD).


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  11. #10
    Confused Corgi Angron88's Avatar
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    I somewhat remember reading that there are 3,000 Grey Knights in an old WD. It's actually quite believable because there are approximately 1,000 Chapters of 1,000 Space Marines (that's one million superhuman mega toopers). I seriousely doubt that in addition to the (Guessing here...) 10 Librarians in each chapter? If there are 10,000 Librarians for some 1,000,000 Marines, I don't think they'd find another 10,000 Libraian potentials to train into elite daemon-killers. 3,000 sounds roughly correct if you think about it; there are about 13,000 Psyker marines meaning about 3/4 would go with the Marines and another 1/4 are left hidden to kill daemons and stop chaos cultists.

    It was mentioned there were 200 Marines who attacked a planet by GrandMaster Salem.

    I finished the book last night at 3am and I remember there were 300 Knights led by 3 grand masters to kill a daemon prince and hold off nearly a million daemons of Tzeentch (there were at least a few hundred Greater Daemons. Only one of the Grand Masters were recovered and no one else was found after the battle. If there are only 3 Grand Masters, then the entire infrastructure of the Grey Knights Command would have been shattered for a few years. I think there would be about 6 Grand Masters for whenever they need to be called on, and a Lord Grand Master in the conclave seat.

    But hey, I am kind of new to fluffing, so feel free to ignore my rantings

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