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    A newb that requires some help with arming his army...

    I am unsure if this is allowed or even effective. Since i have only played 4 games of warhammer so far... What i want to do is equip my command squad with storm bolters. This is the idea,
    Librarian - Force weapon, Storm Bolter, Storm Shield, termie honours, veil of time
    Champion - termie honours, power weapon, combat shield, storm bolter
    Apothecary - termie honours, storm bolter
    Vet Sergeant - termie honours, Power Fist, bolt pistol, storm shield
    The rest would be close combat weapon and bolt pistol.

    Is this allowed to do by the rules? From what i understand it is, but not all miniatures games work the same. I figured if it did work why isn't it used more often, hence the reason why i am asking...

    Also with the actual model how do you define a storm shield and a combat shield? looking at the close assault termies a large shield is a storm shield, but looking at the space marines command squad the large shield is a combat shield... Does it matter?

    Thanks for your help. I greatly appreciate it.


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  3. #2
    LO Zealot Tyrael-RM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quade Collins
    I am unsure if this is allowed or even effective. Since i have only played 4 games of warhammer so far... What i want to do is equip my command squad with storm bolters. This is the idea,
    Librarian - Force weapon, Storm Bolter, Storm Shield, termie honours, veil of time
    Champion - termie honours, power weapon, combat shield, storm bolter
    Apothecary - termie honours, storm bolter
    Vet Sergeant - termie honours, Power Fist, bolt pistol, storm shield
    The rest would be close combat weapon and bolt pistol.

    Is this allowed to do by the rules? From what i understand it is, but not all miniatures games work the same. I figured if it did work why isn't it used more often, hence the reason why i am asking...

    Also with the actual model how do you define a storm shield and a combat shield? looking at the close assault termies a large shield is a storm shield, but looking at the space marines command squad the large shield is a combat shield... Does it matter?

    Thanks for your help. I greatly appreciate it.
    Champion, and apothcary, you cannot take a storm bolter.

    I Don't think sheilds really matter, a shield is just a sheild, I'd just play with whatever rules I felt like it. I dont think shields are necessary at all, unless you think you'll be playing against an enemy who'd negate your 3+ power armour saves in hand to hand.

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    Sorry why can't i change the weapons of the apothecary and company champion?
    In the book it says all specialists may select additional equipment from the armoury if they have terminator honours. Does that not override their basic equipment?

    And i have been beaten badly by power weapons or rending claws... i thought the storm shield gave an invulnerable save which will at least help against those attacks. or am i wrong? (i lost my librarian to a broodlord, even if it died as well, i figure with veil of time i can re-roll enough invulnerable saves to keep him alive)
    Last edited by Quade Collins; March 18th, 2006 at 22:11.

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    Senior Member BringerOfStorms's Avatar
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    Storm shields work well, but they take away the extra CC attack of having two CC weapons. Combat shields work well and for the points cost, getting a 5+ invulnerable save in CC is pretty neat, especially when fighting monstrous creatures or power weapons.
    Bolter Blasting Blizzard = Victory

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    Ender of Threads Wraith's Avatar
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    Well, equipment rules and such aside, you appear to have an assault based command squad, but packing Storm Bolters.

    Take my word for it, SB's are much nicer than bolters or bolt pistols... But then, I play Grey Knights, so I can still fight as double armed. You can't, so the tactic doesn't make too much sense. I'll virtually guarantee you that when this squad hits combat (which it should be doing, based on the weapons), the extra hits from the Force Weapon, Power Weapon and Apothecary (who would do quite well with a pistol/CCW combo as well) will do you far more good than all the extra bolter rounds you're likely to get out of the squad.

    You want shooty? Take a Devastator squad. These guys are built to be assault monsters, don't weaken them trying to make them shooty, too.

    You're right, they can take equipment options, as they do have honours. Storm shields and Combat shields both provide invulnerable saves in combat. Storm gives a better save, but you can't take a second weapon (the hand's busy holding the shield). Combat gives a slightly weaker save, but it's strapped to the forearm, so you can still have two 1-handed weapons (BP/CCW, etc.).

    Just a suggestion, but have you considered giving the Librarian a Familiar? 10 points to hit at I6, and an extra meat shield if things go horribly wrong? Pretty sweet deal, IMHO... give the squad Furious Charge and your Librarian is doing his thing at I7! :yes: Consider swapping the VoT for Might of Heroes as well - adding extra attacks to a Librarian or a Powerfist Sergeant is always useful.
    We've got plenty of youth... How about a fountain of smart?


  7. #6
    Now with STFU flames! Caluin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quade Collins
    Sorry why can't i change the weapons of the apothecary and company champion?
    You can, but it becomes cost-prohibitive. Legally, you're right on. But most people don't bother giving anything but the Veteran Sergeant Terminator Honours because it makes the squads very expensive. Your cheapest model in that squad starts running 25 points before counting in any veteran skills you might buy for them.

    As for Storm Bolters, the reason you don't see many characters running around with them is that they're two handed weapons. If a model has access to the armoury, they're typically going to buy an expensive close combat weapon that will tear things apart in Close Combat such as power weapons, power fists, and the like. By buying the Storm Bolter, you're costing yourself the +1 attack bonus for two one handed weapons, which weakens your over all ability in Close Combat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Quade Collins
    And i have been beaten badly by power weapons or rending claws... i thought the storm shield gave an invulnerable save which will at least help against those attacks. or am i wrong?
    No, you're right - if you happen to see a lot of Close Combat weapons that negate armour saves, the Combat Shield would probably be in your best interest to take. You don't see them often because an invulnerable save on a unit sergeant is usually a waste (as they have meat shield to take their hits for them) and Independant Characters usually have something better, like a Rosarius or Iron Halo.

    As for the size of the shield, that's up to modeler's discretion. I don't think too many people are going to fuss if you claim a huge shield as a Combat Shield.


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    Wraith that was how i originally had my army set up. The only problem was since i am new, i played a 750pnt game against necrons, by the time i slogged across the board only my librarian and his familiar were left, then another round of shooting, and the familiar died and he was down a wound.

    Then the second game i played genestealers with broodlord infiltrated i figured the only way i could survives was attack, i had furious assault and a familiar, thats why the librarian killed the broodlord.

    I thought losing one CC attack each but gaining possibly 6 bolter attacks per turn of slogging would work. I am just trying to get what works best. Also can i have a close combat weapon, a storm bolter and a shield? I know i lose the +1 for two weapons since i am not a grey knight (from the storm bolter) hence the storm shield over combat shield.

    Thanks for the input.

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    Senior Member BringerOfStorms's Avatar
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    Best bet for Combat shields are the little shields that come with Grey Knight Terminators. If you buy one GK Termi blister pack it will come with 5 of the little shields, and they work great... here is a pic of my Librarian with the combat shield, and his familiar...

    Please excuse the painting, I did he and the familiar in about an hour just cause I wanted to instant kill my buddies carnifex.
    Bolter Blasting Blizzard = Victory

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    he looks good Bringer. I actually bought the black templar upgrade package. It comes with four decent looking small shields on them. I had used a Termie black templar shoulder pad as a shield, but it really didn't work. Although the whole original idea is now moot, i don't mind sacrificing the extra attack in close combat for some extra shooting power on the librarian, but can i have a two handed gun and a close combat weapon? It really sucks being a newb....

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    Senior Member BringerOfStorms's Avatar
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    I believe that you CAN have a two handed weapon and a CC weapon. Don't have the BBB in front of me, but I think so.
    Bolter Blasting Blizzard = Victory

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