Multiple allies question - Warhammer 40K Fantasy
 

Welcome to Librarium Online!

Join our community of 80,000+ members and take part in the number one resource for Warhammer and Warhammer 40K discussion!

Registering gives you full access to take part in discussions, upload pictures, contact other members and search everything!


Register Now!

User Tag List

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 11
  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    56
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Reputation
    1 (x1)

    Multiple allies question

    I know this has been discussed before, so I apologize for asking again, but my searching for the past threads wasn't any help.

    Basically, is it possible to have my Daemonhutner army allied with both Space Marines and Witch Hunters?

    According to the interactive army list, this was perfectly legal, and the discussions I've had with the guys I play with seem like it could go both ways.

    Basically the daemonhunters part was going to consist of an inquisitor, daemonhosts, and death cult assassins, the witch hunter part was going to be Arco-Flagellents and a Sisters squad with a priest so I can field the arcos, and then the rest would be space marines with the rare instance of including a Seraphim Squad or replacing the Arcos with Sisters Repentia.

    The other question is, if this is legal, can I still mount the sisters squads in an Immolator, seeing as how I can't have Immolators in my DH army.

    Thanks for any help
    -Justin


  2. Remove Advertisements
    Librarium-Online.com
    Advertisements
     

  3. #2
    Senior Member Heathen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Liverpool, England
    Age
    34
    Posts
    383
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    ReputationReputation
    26 (x1)

    AFAIK you can't have Allied WH and Allied SM in the same DH list. You can have one inducted element (most usually IG, and always so in the case of the DH) and one Allied element, but since both the SoBs and Smurfs are allies rather than inductees, no go. That's how it was explained to me, I might be wrong though ^^

    Also, the only real way to get an Immolator into the DH is as a transport; you can take Dominion squads in them and IIRC you can give them to your HQs and Celestians and the suchlike, however you can't take Heavy Support from allied lists. If you really wanted one I'd go for the HQ transport; Dominions remove the 1 allied FA slot you get and they aren't fantastic unless you're rushing and dumping a few squads of them (or so I'm told) whereas Seraphim have Jump Back and are pretty good at screwing up tactics and suchforth.

  4. #3
    The Orange Grey Knight MiketehFox's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Kelowna, BC, Canada
    Age
    28
    Posts
    3,830
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    ReputationReputationReputationReputationReputationReputationReputation
    196 (x8)

    The fact that GW did Inducted guard and Allied SMs was silly, now we have all this confusion.

    The way I see, It's legal.

    Mike

  5. #4
    Senior Member Heathen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Liverpool, England
    Age
    34
    Posts
    383
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    ReputationReputation
    26 (x1)

    True, what's the point of having Allied Smurfs if you can't use Chapter traits?

  6. #5
    The Orange Grey Knight MiketehFox's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Kelowna, BC, Canada
    Age
    28
    Posts
    3,830
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    ReputationReputationReputationReputationReputationReputationReputation
    196 (x8)

    Well, the rules for allies were made before the trait system came out....

    Mike

  7. #6
    I am a free man! number6's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    The Village
    Posts
    4,941
    Mentioned
    18 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Reputation
    ReputationReputation
    786 (x8)

    Yes, it's perfectly legal to field a DH base army with allied space marines and witch hunter units. Generally, you are only allowed to ally with one other imperial army. However, the various branches of the inquisition can always ally with each other, within the limits proscribed in the appropriate codex. (Though the rules are actually the same in both of them, so you can look at either to get the exact specifics.)

    So, since you're base DH army list won't have any GKs, you can ally with space marines. And since SoB are part of the WHs, you can take a limited number of units of them, too.

    From the WH, I'd definitely take Seraphim over anything else on offer. You won't be disappointed.
    The only way you can get an Immolator is as a dedicated transport with one of the following: Dominions (fast attack), Celestians (elite), or a Cannoness with Celestian retinue (HQ). Make no mistake, the Immolator is a fantastic assault tank, and IMHO, they really work best when you've got a unit of celestians inside. Take Seraphim for your WH allied fast attack choice.
    ninjabackhand: point and click, again, really? even after i give you an military term "shock tactic" you still call it point and click.
    RIP Warhammer 40,000: 21 Sep 1998 - 24 May 2014

  8. #7
    The Orange Grey Knight MiketehFox's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Kelowna, BC, Canada
    Age
    28
    Posts
    3,830
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    ReputationReputationReputationReputationReputationReputationReputation
    196 (x8)

    But how can you say no to a Dominion squad that can lay down 6 Flamer Templates? (4 Flamers, 1 Combi Flamer and the Immy's TL H. Flamer)

    But hey, thats just me

    Mike

  9. #8
    Son of LO mEGALOMANIAC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Cranston, RI
    Age
    32
    Posts
    3,532
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    ReputationReputationReputationReputationReputation
    103 (x8)

    Yes, it's legal to use both SM and WH in a DH list (or IG instead of the SM). The reason is because the WH unit is an allied contingent, while the SM section is actually part of the Daemonhunters' army list.

    * The mandatory 2 Troops & 1 HQ must come from the base list - in this case, Daemonhunters. No WH or SM units can fufill those basic requirements.

    * A single FOC is used for the entire army list. So while you may take choices from DH, WH, and SM, you cannot have more than 6 Troops total, or 3 Fast Attack total, etc.

    * And, as was already pointed out, you must still use army composition rules. No SM & GK in one army, for example. No SoB & SM together. There is no rule against SoB & GK being in the same force, so that's alright. Use of Daemonhosts requires a Malleous Inquisitor, and use of assassins still requires some kind of Inquisitor present.

    * You cannot, however, induct SM or IG into the allied WH contingent (so no DH/SM/WH/IG army, sorry).

    * Also, no Traits or Doctrines for the SM or IG in this list. This rule always applies unless the IG or SM component is the base army and the WH/DH parts are allies.

  10. #9
    I am a free man! number6's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    The Village
    Posts
    4,941
    Mentioned
    18 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Reputation
    ReputationReputation
    786 (x8)

    Quote Originally Posted by MiketehFox
    But how can you say no to a Dominion squad that can lay down 6 Flamer Templates? (4 Flamers, 1 Combi Flamer and the Immy's TL H. Flamer)

    But hey, thats just me
    'Cause Seraphim bring more flexibility and speed to the table.
    And ... I'm just biased that way. Seraphim are right up there with GKs as my favorite units in the 40K game. What's not to love about 'em?
    Quote Originally Posted by mEGALOMANIAC
    No SoB & SM together.
    The way I understood it was thusly:
    When DH is the parent list, you can't use GKs.
    When WH is the parent list, you can't use SoB.
    However, when DH is the parent list -- even if you take allied SM units -- you can also take allied SoB units.
    Similarly, when WH is the parent list -- even if you take allied SM units -- you can also take allied GK units.
    Last edited by number6; April 10th, 2006 at 17:16.
    ninjabackhand: point and click, again, really? even after i give you an military term "shock tactic" you still call it point and click.
    RIP Warhammer 40,000: 21 Sep 1998 - 24 May 2014

  11. #10
    Son of LO mEGALOMANIAC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Cranston, RI
    Age
    32
    Posts
    3,532
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    ReputationReputationReputationReputationReputation
    103 (x8)

    Quote Originally Posted by number6
    The way I understood it was thusly:
    When DH is the parent list, you can't use GKs.
    When WH is the parent list, you can't use SoB.
    That makes no sense - you can always use GK in a DH list, and SoB in a WH list. It's the inducted SM that are disallowed in those circumstances. But if what you were trying to say was that in a base DH army, you couldn't combine GK and SM, then you're correct that it isn't legal. And same with trying to combine Sob & SM in a base WH army.

    However, when DH is the parent list -- even if you take allied SM units -- you can also take allied SoB units.
    Similarly, when WH is the parent list -- even if you take allied SM units -- you can also take allied GK units.
    This is actually true. The allied contingent (WH or DH) doesn't have to follow the same rule as the base list does. Thats how we get SM armies with allied GK or SoB.

    But on that topic - whats the point of having all of those in one army? SoB & GK I can see, as they're on the opposite extremes (assaulty and shooty) of the power armor spectrum. But SM are smack in the middle - they don't really serve any purpose that the GK/SoB combination can't perform, and the GK/SoB don't fill any SM weakness. So by making a DH/WH/SM list, you're shooting yourself in the foot - you're disallowing either GK or SoB, whichever is the parent list, and not really getting anything in return.

    An odd loophole: If your base army is SM (or IG), you can ally in BOTH DH and WH contingents. This isn't mentioned in c:DH, but it is mentioned in c:WH in a manner that makes it retroactively apply to DH. Each contingent follows the standard limits seperately (0-1 HQ, 0-1 Elite, etc), but it all contributes to the same FOC like always. This is, in fact, the only legal way to field SM, GK, and SoB in a single Force Organization Chart. But like my argument just above, why bother? ;-)

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts