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I know this thread has been brought up a number of times, but it has been a long time, and I couldn't find them by searching. There are quite a few problems with our Codex; it was the first to be revised, and thus it seems GW used us as a 'guinea pig' for futher codices' revisions. I also have some problems with the Doctrines, which can be found in my post here. Now for the rest of the Codex to recieve my wrath:
Where did all the combi weapons go? I'd have liked to field one.
The shotgun is useless, and I'd say it needs a revision, as well as being free or worth the point that a bolter is.
Force Weapons cost too much for a model that cannot do much with one. The off-chance that an insta-kill will happen costing nearly half what an Infantry Squad costs is like a lascannon costing 200 points on the chance that it can kill a Land Raider
Our bionics should be like the Chaos ones, as they cost the same.
Servitors should not cost against wargear- a single servitor could potentially eat almost all of a Techpriest's wargear allowance.
An Officer should be clarified as being a regular character in his squad, and reverting to an independent character when it is wiped out. See this thread. This would make an Officer with a powerfist worth taking.
The High Commander (Chapter Approved) should be fully legal and indeed incorporatedd into the Codex.
We need more opportunities to use demo charges.
Sanctioned Psykers need better powers, and need to be able to select them from the
Armory; they also need a better profile for 12 points.
Commissars should be a little better for their points.
Priests are the antithesis of a Guard unit, since they always count the unit as moving; they should also carry a laspistol and CCW like all the other characters.
Vets should get access to the Veteran Officer- I thought he was tight, though a tad expensive without a Leadership bubble.
Stormtroopers across the Codices should get the same rule as the ones in WH to represent Arbites, with the improved shotgun I mentioned.
Ogryns cost as much as a GK Terminator but aren't worth as much.
Our special and heavy weapons costs should not be comparable, much less more, to those of SM- they are better at firing them and much more survivable.
Techpriests should be better than quacks that pretend they can fix vehicles- on a 6+ is ridiculous, and beginning a turn in contact is too. He should be treated as a regular character when his Servitors are present, and revert to an independent character like the Officer when it is wiped out.
Conscripts should have a lot less points cost on their weapons- they can barely fire them!
Why in the name of all that is holy don't Roughriders have frag grenades?
Sentinels cost too much in my opinion, as do their weapons.
FW tanks should be incorporated into the IG list- including the Griffon, Exterminator, and blessed Vanquisher.
Really, shouldn't the option to fire indirect with a gun designed to do so come standard?
I don't like Creed, and Macharius and Deddog should return- if a thousand SM chapters get so many special characters, millions of IG regiments should get at least as many.
Last Chancers are more points than they're worth. All their specialties add up too quickly to translate into effective combinations on the battlefield.
See my post here.
Catachan sprues need to be brought up to par with the Catachan heavy weapons sprue, at least.
New plastics need to be made- this metal Vostroyan crap is BS. Tallarn, Valhallan, Armageddon, Tanith... these poor people, and others, have waited long enough!
Currently, the Ogryn models are absolutely terrible, as are Ratlings and Rough Riders.
I'd like to see some plastic Stormtroopers, Rough Riders.
Any comments or anything I missed would be great. People like me will continually bring this up too, so it should probably be pinned .
Acutally, there were a series of threads all titled "Codex Revisions" that bring up nearly every point you made here.
For the most part, people agree with many of your statements. Especially the Ogryn and the Shotgun. They are both pretty stupid. Sniper rifles had a huge debate recently too, but I'm not sure if a solution was reached.
No no no, I wasn't trying to cut you down or anything, just point you in the direction so you could read them and join in all the fun.
I have no problem with this post. If GW reads forums, then the fact that we keep talking about the same problems over and over and over should show them that we don't like some of the stuff in our codex.
I actually like that our stormtroopers get free frag and krak grenades unlike the inquisitorial ones that only get free frags. The option to arm a stormtrooper sarge with a basic hellgun would be nice however.
Overall your suggestions are pretty spot on though, except for the one about the officer and retinue. It would still create the same victory points issues that exist today. They should really cost officers at -20 points, with a mandatory retinue of 4 men at 5 points each. That way the retinue would count as a squad for VP purposes, and the officer as an independant for VP purposes, and you wouldn't get instances of people killing a retinue as they are now, and getting 0 VP for it because the officer is unwounded or some other.
I also strongly agree that the AC list tanks should be standard choices for normal IG army lists. If only I could use exterminators.. far and away my fave tank of all time.
What Guardsmen dont want to hear...
"Ok boys, time to fix bayonets!"
Ya IG really need more tank option's. They dumbed that part of the army down so much it aint even funny.
The whole way Advisors work with the army needs to be looked at. Same as there point cost.
All these changes wont happen for a VERY VERY LONG time though. Eldar and Orks codex's need to be looked @ before IG. Throw in the big space marine chapters and its going to be 2010 before we get our chance. Then of course we have Dark Eldar and the rumors about the xeno codex.
We are also just getting a new model troop choice (Vostroyans) who in my opinion look kick ass! so i dont see GW releasing any new stuff for IG for a while.
Last edited by hardcastle; April 16th, 2006 at 17:24.
Admittably, it will be a while, but DE and Dark Angels got a full Codex revision in the middle of third ed in CA, I believe. I do agree that Vostroyans are cool, but they still should have released plastic ones in my opinion. So much less expensive, so much more modeling opportunities...Originally Posted by hardcastle
I look at it this way... We can't be too greedy. There are several armies out there in dire need of a whole redo. We on the other hand have a pretty decent codex, and wanting a redo on some things that seem pretty minor IMO is just greedy lol. Guard have plenty of options to win and do lots of fun stuff with.
I think of the new releases Vostroyans might be the last we see of small range plastic models like the Tanith.
With all the new fangled tech and junk plastic is the new...plastic!
I agree with most of your points. Shotguns are useless with the new rapidfire rules, that is of course unless your planning to assault which is foolhardy.
However our heavy weapons cost is high for a reason.
Most of the Space marine weapons have low cost, infantry have a high cost.
Our Infantry have a low cost, our heavy weapons have a high cost.
It works out, in a roundabout way. If our heavy weapons cost as much as the SM ones, well it'd be heaven, but we'd get 10 men and a Lascannon, for the same as 5 Marines.
Ogryns, Advisors, Servitors need a look at IMO.
Techpriests are ok. Give him 4 tech servitors, you're fixing on a 2+. In large (huge) games, the cost can be justified because you are likely to have a large firebase of tanks which he can tend to.
Whilst that is situational, he can work well in 1500ish ranges too. It's points better spent elsewhere, but he can be used in that situation.
Mortars are ok as well. Give them to a Command Squad, then hide your bubble totally out of LoS but in a good area to use his Ld bubble. This gives you're squad which was previously doing naff all but giving Ld, gets pot shots at the enemy which can cause pinning tests.
Lots of the stuff in the 'dex is situational (or crap) like the Ogryns, Sentinels, Pyschers, Conscripts, Commisars...Well anything that isn't in a standard list.
It could do with a little touch up, tweaks to the existing 'dex, bringing it in line with the newer stuff.
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