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What does everyone think about the feasibility of IG jump troops? I would love to see them personally. If they were to be introduced I would have them something like this:
Equipment- Jump-packs, laspistol, close combat weapon, flak armor
Options- Upgrade to veteran sergeant (power weapon access like storm troopers) and up to two special weapons (flamer +6pts or meltagun +10pts)
This would count as a fast attack choice or maybe an elites choice?
I was considering posting the below as an article:
A Doctrine too far - Imperial Guard Drop Troop Tactica
I have been tempted to write this for a while as I find myself saying the same thing over again on the IG forum, this is basically a guide to the uses of the drop troop doctrine available from codex IG. I am going to try and bite my tongue and not mention my Elysians (damn did it already) or general forgeworld goodness that fits so well with the doctrine (Vuture gunships)
So mostly we have all seen “A bridge too far” or “Black hawk down” right? All excited? Want to field an army which deep strikes onto the battlefield and through heroic courage and skill at arms manages to save they day? The look no further (this could put you off the idea for life)
Classically paratroops are used as part of a combined arms operation, taking objectives ahead of an advancing body of troops. This really doesn’t equate to the skirmish scale of 40K but it can be used in the game. Add to this that fact that IG generally stands and shoots relying on putting down a hail of fire for as many turns as possible as the opponent treks towards them, however the drop troop doctrine when applied to a unit means the unit gets fewer turns shooting having missed at least the first one and starts closer to the enemy. Disaster? Not entirely, deep striking isn’t on of those “All or nothing” doctrines, you can give it to selected units, which brings us, rather laboriously, to the first area:
Partly drop troop Armies
This is the most common usage of the drop troop doctrine, the main body of the army is played as standard IG army but selected units are given the deep strike ability in order to “reach out and touch someone”
In theory odd squads can be deep struck onto objectives, a cunning plan, probably best reserved for storm troopers, but don’t expect them to hold onto it if your opponent makes any serious attempt to take it, even a squad of stormies cant cope that well in close combat, rather, if you have units arriving very late, drop them onto objectives that are well clear of your opponent, but this is more or less a target of opportunity rather than a planned tactic.
By far the most common use of drop troop doctrine is the creation of a suicide squad that lands next to an opponent unit and destroys it, subsequently they tend to get wiped out but some units are very effective at this. The two riders on this are that firstly you can not guarantee the squad wont deviate/scatter, often this makes them completely ineffective so don’t rely on them as an absolute, secondly the nature of deep strike means you wont be using these squads in turn 1 so don’t depend on them to take out armour or fast elites that will do their damage early on. Classics include:
Special weapons squads with flamers and/or demo charges – these can devastate full squads of the biggest, hardest units in your opponents’ army, and rather pleasingly the demo charge reinforces the suicide nature of the squad by deviating back on to its own unit half the time
Special weapons squads with meltaguns and/or demo charges – again can devastate MEQs but clearly can take out tanks very effectively
Veteran squads (small in numbers) with 3 flamers or 3 meltas – can do the same as above
Arguably platoon HQs tooled with flamers or meltas can do this too but this is rather a waste of the points spent on an officer
Sentinels – the most common option being the heavy flamer which can kill troops effectively, but equally all other options can get access to the rear armour of vehicles
But I see myself as Gene Hackman in a beret with a dodgy Polish accent
Ok so if you genuinely want to play a drop troop army and drop everything onto the table, then.. your forces are going to arrive piecemeal and off target, you can not out fight your opponent and you have hampered your shooting, all you have is guts and the bare faced refusal to look facts in the face! Me, I am in! This isn’t an army for the inexperienced or faint hearted; it needs to be played cunningly and innovatively. You need to hit hard and then hold on for dear life
Classically my drop troops, when the Elysian rules are banned, takes the iron discipline doctrine. All squads have voxs and the Command HQ has a master vox. All squads take vet sgts. The HQs provide fire support from as many special weapons as I can get into them, but I do tend to include a medic, roughly the army can be broken down into 3 areas: 2 assault elements and odds and sods. The 2 assault elements are essentially the infantry platoons and their command squads. Each infantry squad has a special weapon and a missile launcher (the only viable heavy weapon mini for the Elysians). In addition to this are the odds and sods, these include special weapons squads (flamers and meltas with demo charge), the HQ command squad, with loads of special weaponry, a sentinel with an Autocannon and improved comms, 2 sentinels with las cannons and HK missiles, veterans and storm troopers.
Identify 1 target per platoon (in my case 2 targets), ideally these are objectives guarded by strong squads. Deep strike platoons around the target, usually the whole platoon around a single objective, and rapid fire into the defenders, what is left will generally charge you, charge it right back, with as much as possible, the only proviso on this is if other units are in the area, you may need to dose these up with fire. Gradually get your units into firing positions on the objective.
Odds and Sods
These have a number of roles, firstly they can reinforce the assault elements, if you feel the entire platoon can not handle the current defenders then support them with an odds and sods unit.
Secondly these units can take out enemy squads threatening your assault units, particularly good for this are the special weapons squads with demo charges, although rolling the scatter dice twice makes you very prone to missing.
Several of these units can be used to take out enemy tanks and fire support, deep striking deep into the enemies deployment zone and chewing up his rear, this can be a suicide mission, but if so will distract your opponent from taking on your assault elements and recapturing the objectives.
These are to all intents and purposes, a tactical reserve to squander or hoard at your peril, generally if they have killed more points than they cost, then they have done their job.
Usually by turn 5 the majority of your army has arrived, most of the odds and sods have been killed or are routing off the board and what is left of your assault elements are hiding in cover around objectives and trying to tough it out. Arnhem all over again, unfortunately 30 Corps is not ever going to arrive, but hey, you have the advantage of the game ending around turn 6 so you just need to tough it out until then
Drop troop armies are a mixed blessing in a cityfight, but can be extremely effective, their lack of vehicles, high numbers, mobile fire power all contributes to make them pretty effective, but don’t deep strike them if at all possible, watching as you entire platoon disappears thanks to the scatter dice gods is not a pleasant feeling.
Most importantly – have fun, enjoy the flamboyance and daring of the army, revel in the fact that your drop knocked your opponents plans into a ****ed hat and by the time he had recovered, the game was over. Personally I always enjoy sitting through the deployment phase with my arms crossed looking smug and watching my opponent get anxious on turn 2 when I pick up the dice for the reserve rolls
Last edited by Cheredanine; April 20th, 2006 at 14:42.
Everything you have been told is a lie!
That is a very good tactica, but I was talking about IG assault troops with jetpacks that can move 12" and assault 6" as opposed to deep striking troops. Sorry I may have been unclear.
classically adding jet packs/jump packs adds 15+ points to the value of the mini, why in gods name would I want to cahrge someone quicker? IG shoot, they are pretty naff at it but get a lot of shots, that is where they inflict hurt, what they are not is a fast assault army, you can just about get away with a mobbed bayonette charge against some armies but a single assault squad? stick to rough riders
Everything you have been told is a lie!
No way! Assault marines (and remember, they are marines with far superior statlines) get jet packs for only +7pts. If marines can get jetpacks for +7pts, I see no reason why IG couldn't get them for +9pts. I think that an IG assault squad could be really fun to use. It would have a chance against a lot of armies. If you gave a squad of 10 2 flamers and a veteran sergeant, it would have 2 flamer shots, 8 laspistol shots, and 31 attacks on the charge. The attacks aren't very good, but that is bound to take down a few marines.Originally Posted by Cheredanine
I'm not a big fan of rough riders. I see them as too much fantasy and not enough 40k. Cmon IG, get with the times. It's 40,000 years into the future and it's high time you dropped the horses for some jetpacks. That's what I say. When I played marines some time ago, my assault marines were always my favorite unit just because they're fun to move around, if nothing else. Maybe IG could even have a crazy unit size, like 5-20 assault troopers.
Actually you are right abut the poitns, but that is quite recent, so you are going to pay about 170+ points for 10 IG? your choice
Everything you have been told is a lie!
I like the idea of jumpers too. Really, I think the different 'fast' models (bikes, cavalry, jump) all have different strategies that could be applied to them. I think it is perfectly fluffy as well. RR move 12" on the charge, bikes and jump move 12" on the move. And jump ignores terrain if moved over all the way. So while RR are more of a countercharge, jump and bike are more of a way to move fire support quickly, which would be nice. I think Guard should get jump and bikes. It does say in the BGB that "every army" has bikes (can't remember page but it did say under bikes section) and that thus far is a lie.
Very true- perhaps they could even tone them down to 12pts a model or so. Afterall, we're still talking about guardsmen with a 5+ save. For 170pts, almost all armies would be better off taking an 2 fully loaded squads with lascannons and plasma guns- but for say 140 (if they were 12 points a model +flamers, etc) it might be a feasible choice for objective grabbing or to tie up a shooty devastator squad, carnifex or dreadnought. Even if they weren't the best buys in the world, I would still take them because they are so fun to play with.Originally Posted by Cheredanine
hey i had an idea for you fast attack choices, you could mout the rough riders on jetbike looking things either the eeldar ones or custom ones, also a substitute for a chimera could be a flying platfoms, like the one in akira. also to add to your idea i too love the idea of jump troops aswell, i think it would be a great idea and if done correctly can look amazing
:w00t: The best way to play with Jump Packs for IG is take a Witchunter squad of Seraphim. These are lovely ladies that to an awesome job of delivering some AP1 (look up Devine Guidance) death to our enemies.
They can be taken as an Allied Fast attack choice. Try them, they are a lot of fun.:yes:
"A love for tradition has never weakened a nation, indeed it has strengthened nations in their hour of peril."
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