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just wandering what everyone thinks of cc HQs. i was thinkin carapace armour, commisar and heroic senior officer with power fist, veteran with honorifica imperialis and power sword and 3 more veterans with power swords. thats a hell of decent cc attacks for around 200 points or something like that
Where there's a will there's a weapon
i would proably not do that because i normaly just use my HQ for leadership perpuses and becasue i have to take one ( my real fighter is a vet serg in my vet squad with power fist carapace and honorifica imperialis)
Veterans cant buy power weapons from the armoury. An officer with a powerfist is a poor choice as he strikes last and can be individually targetted first, as well as must be in base to base contact with the enemy to even participate at all.Originally Posted by geom
As has been mentioned many, many times before, if you want IG CC capability, rough riders or allied GK's are your best bet. A HQ choice command squad cant even abuse close order drill, making them an even poorer choice.
What Guardsmen dont want to hear...
"Ok boys, time to fix bayonets!"
As mentioned previously, you can't have vets with power swords, sryOriginally Posted by geom
Anyway, I've had some successes and some serious failures with a guard cc hq, and here's what I've gleaned...
You have to remember that a power fist on a hso is basically a rip off, especially compared to the space marine equivilent. You're paying the same points for something that's considerably less effective. Between a commissar, power fist, power sword, and whatever other upgrades you throw on there, your hso cc command squad is really, quite expensive and that's just to get it up to mediocre, not to make it into a good or excellent unit. Any army's close combat specialists will tear through them like a knife through hot butter, and suddenly you'll have spent in the neighborhood of 250-300 points and quite possibly several doctrine points (Iron Discipline or Diehards, Hardened Fighters, and perhaps Commissars, Priests, and Psykers) into something that will ultimately fail in every endevor.
For roughly the same pointage, you could easily ally some Grey Knights that would do MUCH better point for point, or you could get a squadron or two of rough riders as a real, nasty, close combat arm. So, is there any reason to even consider taking this squad?
Actually, yes, there is. If you take infantry platoons instead of grenadiers as your troops, at the very least, you have 3 officers roaming around. Basically, what this means is that if you can find a way to make this close combat unit more of an irritating obstruction rather then a poor excuse for a cc specialist, you could have a lot more success. I typically give my HSO carapace, a plasma pistol, and a power sword. That's it. I also take the Independent Commissars doctrine in my army, and I always make sure to attach 1 of my 3 commissars to my HSO, (one has to go to my conscript platoon, of course, and the other goes to one of my remaining officers). That's a (relatively) inexpensive counter-assault. I always deploy my officers amongst their soldiers because that method of sharing leadership is a tad more reliable (and cheaper) then the vox network (not dissing the vox network though, I still take that... back on topic though). Basically, the important part of the story is here: my officers are already standing out amongst the men ANYWAY, and the guardsmen hate to be charged, right? 2 birds can be easily killed with one stone by using the officers and irritating roadblocks. The HSO in particular has enough wounds on him that he's just going to be a cast-iron biotch to kill, and if there's an independent commissar following him around, maybe he can draw some attacks away from the hso, which can help keep him alive. Anyway, the officer is there to charge the enemy when they get within range of my line, and with any luck, they tie them up for at least 1 turn, because if the enemy's big assault is broken down and becomes disorganized, it's easier to beat back and therefore easier to keep the bulk of your army out of close combat.
So, long story short, having a cc HQ isn't the best idea in the world if you imagine him as a behemoth who strides about slaughtering warbosses or berzerkers or anything like that. If you keep him as an expendable (and irritating) roadblock, it may give your army the edge it needs to stay cool when you are about to be charged, and hopefully drain the enemy of some of his initiative.
If you want a strong cc monster though, just get a brother-captain or a squad of grey knights in power armor, much simpler.
and in the future, please use the search function, I've said this in about 12 threads in the past month...:rolleyes:
"And any man who comes through this fight mostly unharmed will be my sister! It'll be free frocks and jollies for ever, you'll see!"
- Rome: Total War
9th Black Watch (Imperial Guard) 4000 points
Red Corsairs of Khorne 2000 points
Space Wolves 13th Company 2000 points
You can spend how many points you want on boosting up your HQ for close combat, the fact still remains that any other army spending half the points on gear will probably maul your HQ without breaking a sweat. Guardsmen are easy victory points. Luckily for us, they're not that many victory points... untill you try to tool them up. Then they're alot of easy victory points.Originally Posted by geom
I made a post a while back on a similar subject. Since I'm such a twat, I'll link you to it, someone might even find it usefull.
well you can't really tool up a CC hq squad but there is a lil something that can prove very useful.
Sticking an Officer in cover with a power sword can kill a lot of things. I've seen him down a few termies so if he ever gets into CC he'll at least make his points back.
But yeah, the HQ is an LD giver and shouldn't be trust into close combat unless it is a very desperate circumstance.
"Heresy is like a garden weed, it won't stop feeding until you... BURN THE WHOLE DAMN GARDEN WITH A FLAMER, BURN IT, BURN IT TO HELL!!!!!" "Is there a wittle puppy in the garden? ITS A DAEMON! BURN IT!"