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ok, so recently i started space marines and so far ive been doing pretty well. in the few games i've played so far, i beat anouther marine player, tied with an iperial guard player, and completely destroyed a few tyranid players. however, i will soon be facing a chaos player(an old rival of mine from when i played tau) who i've never played against with my marines. one thing that is kind of making me doubt whether or not i can do well against him is that he fields some super duper ubber lord of doom!!! i'm can't recall everything he has on his chaos lord, but i do remeber him saying its a demon prince with daemonic speed that cant be instant killed, or killed by a force weapon, who is str6 w/ an axe of khorne.
i know that i can take him out, but to do so i would have to expend a large amount of man power and i fear that he could severly cripple my army with this one dude, making me easy picking for the rest of his army. i want some advice on how to deal with such a ubber lord without wasting to many good marines to take him down. usually, i wouldn't really mind too much whether i win or lose, its just that this guy(despite the fact that i'm a really good friiend with him) is really competative and will be bragging about how his ubber lord of doom owned my army and that he's a better general than me and all that bull sh$t. any way, some advice about how to counter this ubber lord would be apreciated.
From what you mention it sounds like a Khornate Daemon Prince, they're hard it's true the hardest can havea 4+ invulnerable and Feel no Pain against Lascanon.
However this guy looks like having only a 5+ Invulnerable, without knowing what else in the way of equipment he has (Toughness 4, 5 or 6? immune to instant death or not, 3 or 4 wounds, FnP?) it's hard to give much advice, the collar of khorne pretty much prohibits Psyker activity.
One thing to check is wether he's legal or not, alot of Chaos players cheat (unintentionaly) by having too many points worht of Daemonic Gifts, if ther Daemon Prince looks too hard, he'e probably gone overdrawn.
Appart from that a Vindicator can always at least get through his FnP, and possibly instant death him, a single shot can down his 200pt+ model. Appart from that, if you get to attack him in combat he's wounded on a 2+ by Powerfists and only gets a 5+ inv, Powerweapons similarly cause him problems.
I recomend throwing a cheap unit out in his path as bait, (Attack Bikes are a favourite) letting him kill it to get the charge yourself, (possibly with Furious Charge Terminators with Lightning Claws.
If it doesn't have FnP, Plasma it. I it doesn't have a Daemonic Rune, Vindicator it, if it has both then Daemonic Speed, Stature, Strength and Rune he's used alot of his Daemonic Gift points.
One simple thing applys when facing a Khorne Daemon Prince, (trust me, my brother plays khorne and brings this guy alot), don't fight it, shoot.
The best way to go about doing things is to use every piece of shooting you have until it falls. If forced to take enough saves, the law of averages says that it should fail at least enough to wound it significantly. Then, if you want, use hidden powerfists, this will ignore the FNP.
If all else fails, Daemonhunter allies.
If you want to check if his Prince is legal, use this list:
All of the following count towards the Daemonic Points limit:
Marks of Chaos
Gifts of the Gods (wargear and weaponry; not psychic powers)
That should be it.
Or even better, don't use this list.Originally Posted by Adrian_MalSeraph
Marks doesn't count but Psychic gifts from the gods do. but since he is Khornate that would be very strange.
I agree you should not fight him in CC but shoot him. Why not with say a predator or some devestators? Even if he won't be instakilled he'll have no better then a 5+ invul so S8 weaponry still wounds on 2+. He should also have T5 I guess so massed bolter fire will be very annoying. Just make him charge something cheap, kill it, then shoot him.
I used to have one when I played Khorne, as silver wings said, chech if he's legal (this is the first thing to do). I remember mine had around 115 points of demonic gifts :ninja: but that was unintentional of corse and I changed it as soon as it was pointed out. Another suggestion is to *try* not to get in melee, you should lure him in (and this will probably work, because I know I didn't pay attention to where mine went, because I thought he was a god) to where most of your forces can shoot him, if your lucky he won't have a chance, if not he'll go down anyway, be sure to also pay attention to more than just a single guy, most battles I play are won by the army.
And lastly, tell me of the look on his face when his 'uber lord of doom' falls.
Can you hear the voices too?
You're right Anduciassus, silly me. (Must look at Chaos codex more closely next time)Originally Posted by Andusciassus
If you play Dark Angels, using the Sword of Secrets is a godsend. Wounds on 3's or 4's and ignores the FNP, very nice. Every time my Master and his prince meet, we kill each other. Yes, I lost an expensive model, but I look at its as that he's not tearing up my army.
Well along with everyone else, he is probably a Khorne deamon prince, especially if he has Axe of Khorne(only Khorne can use it). They can be very nasty and hard to kill in combat. He infact can be imune to instakill, and have a 4+ chance vs psychic powers(includeing force weapons). But this is the clincher that goes with what silver wings said. He is cheating if the Khorne Prince has deamonic speed. Khorne can't have speed, flight or infiltrate. Basically anything making them go faster. So right there that would be a cheat.
Regardless of what he is tooled with, it's best practice to not get into assault with ANY khorne Lord or Deamon Prince. Shoot them, and stay away. Shoot them with high strength weapons. Deploy so he has to go through/around terrain to get to you. Even with out speed, Khorne can get an extra D6" movement, and if using the Berzerker Glaive, it's gaurenteed they will get that extra movement.
Acctually, Khorne can take speed and flight, says nothing about it Now if he was really smart, he'd either take Glaive/speed or Flight/stature/dread axe. Now, lets go over what we reviewed, k? Khorne can take fast stuff but can;t take glaive and flight. Dreadaxe, flight, and stature=major killer. If only Glaive was one handed...then stature,speed,glaive,and dreadaxe would be the sh!t. Like they said, shootse 'em. Bust out them plasma cannons or lascannons and shoot the big winged(in my daemon princes case) thing!
Ehh.. now this is rather wrong I must say.Originally Posted by Gman
Of course Khornates can have Speed and Flight, but if they do they do not benefit from the extra movement given by Bloodrage.
Please be more careful and don't go around calling people cheaters if you have not cared to check if what you think is right really is.
Also it might be useful to have a unit of scouts or some other cheap unit to slow him down if he gets into charge range. I guess you don't want to change your list so I don't know how that will work. If you do have a cheap sacrificial unit try to set it up so you get the charge. This is only if he will make it to you and you won't stop him quick enough. The charge is very nice though and more importantly he doensn't get it.