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Would the combonation of Cleanse and Purify plus Trust your Battle Brothers and taking a fair number of large tac squads with 2*plasma/2*melta and drop podding them next to your opponents be a sound strategy? Is sinking that many points on regular tac-squads worth it?
What sort of other units would be good to support this? I was thinking a pair of Whirlwinds creating Mayhem while the majority of the army drop pods in. Dreads also might be effective and add to the drop podding force.
Which HQ would be effective? Maybe a librarian with Fear of Darkness?
I haven't bought anything yet, so I'm mostly asking for some composition help. Unfortunately, that also means I've not yet procurred the Codex, although I've read it a number of times at the local shop. It is number one on my list of things to buy.
I face a pretty wide range of enemies, from Orks to Tyranids to Necrons to other Space Marines. About the only thing I wouldn't face would be IG, 'cause I'm the resident IG player at current. xD
I'm not looking to spend a whole LOT of money, but I'm not going to kid myself and imagine it's going to be cheap, and hell, if I can build and IG army, building a SM army should be cake as far as the wallet is concerned...
I usually play static guard so I was hoping for something with a bit more dynanicism. Drop-poding squads sounds very fun which is why I was thinking of this style of army.
My usual store plays in roughly 500 pt. increments, and most people don't have more than 750 pts. so a good 500-750 point start is what I'm looking for.
Armed with this knowledge, what would you guys recommend to me?
OK where to go with this -
Loading up tac squads - This is generally good, most new players go for toys for the boys (big HQs, loads of elites, Fast attack and heavy support and neglect their troops, this is a bad thing, clearly you are bring over IG thoughts, do it.
OK DS armies have 2 choices: DS the whole thing or DS part of it, if you DS part of it you run the risk that your opponent outnumbers/outguns what you have on the table before the rest of your army arives. That doesnt mean dont do it but it neds to be bourne in mind. DSing a whole army, the risk is your army arrives peacemeal in nice bite sized chunks for your opponent to chew up. Bizarely my main DS army is elysians (IG), however:
An entire drop pod army would be fun and interesting to play, considerations are:
1. you nead to be able to deal with the peacemeal issue
2. you are not gonna charge the turn you arrive, so you need to put down decent amounts of fire
3. re your special weapons: Flamers would be a good choice for tac squads, as would plasma, but I would stay away from melta as a general rule, melta guns should be reserved for tank busting and use dedicated squads, rather than put into squads designed to rapid fire your opponent to death
4. Libby fith FoD is a little risky but can be spectacular, it works best with ammassed mobs or low moral troops and is at its worse against fearless troops
Consider the following options for Drop Pod army:
HQ - pretty much any, they have different stgrengths and will come into play at different times, but do give them a command squad with big numbers
Vet squads can be very usefull
Dreads equally, cheap and effective
termies could be used too
Troops: lots of tac squads, stay away from scouts, they cant use the drop pods so will end up primary targets for turn1
FA: Assault squads can DS but less accuratley than drop pods
Land speeders are also a good choice, particularly for a DS army LSTs or standard LS with multi meltas for cheap tank busters
Deep striking dev squad are, I suppose an option
Anyway I suspect this will be quite expensive, particulary if you end up buying forgeworld Drop pods for the units
Everything you have been told is a lie!
Having played Drop Pod armies in a number of different configurations, I think what would work best for you, if your gonna be dropping a bunch of tac squads, is to go 100% and don't deploy anything. Although a whirlwind or two in really good cover does sound really fun, and is not something I have tried.
C&P was almost designed for a Drop Pod army, so you're good there. And TyBB is a good skill, but +__points for each model is an awfull lot. However, if your looking to save money, this means buying less models, which may be an ok thing.
I Find the Librarian to be a good choice, but Fear is often not usefull (chaos are fearless, Orks will just Mob Up) but it's still a good choice. Remember to take a command squad with him, cause a normal command squad gets the second special weapon as part of it's normal rules, so you don't have to pay the price of the Heavy like you do for your tac squads.
Also, I have never played a Drop Pod army in such a small game. It may be difficult in a 500 or 750 point game. Remember that EVERY drop pod is 15 free victory points for your opponents as soon as it hits the ground which may be more difficult to overcome in a smaller game.
Last edited by Katie Drake; September 7th, 2006 at 22:28.
Thanks for the info. ^^ Yeah, I was kinda worried that my IG mentality (lotsa guys, lotsa guns, few frills) was going to get me in trouble... But I also know that Tac Marines are an amazing bunch, so I figured the Emperor's Finest didn't need many frills to make them effective.
I figure by going TYBB, I can make each unit semi-selfsufficent. If a unit gets caught out by it's lonesome and gets charged, well, with 16 Str 4, WS 4 and 3 PF swings, I think I can handle most things for atleast a turn or two. Plus, 4 plasma/2 Flamer Templates and 16 bolter shots will eat most things pretty handily.
I see your point on meltaguns and have revised my mind set however, Str. 8 weapons that can insta-kill characters did sound fairly enticing for a first round of shooting.
The idea behind the whirlwinds, honestly, was to put them behind some terrain and let them shell the crap out of stuff before my Droppods fell. Maybe it's the IG mentality and the love of hidden basis, but being able to drop ordanance on my opponents a couple of times prior to getting the marines stuck in sounds like a sound plan. If nothing else, it might get my opponent to split his forces up so that I have an easier time isolating and obliterating individual parts of his army.
You guys mentioned that any of the HQs would be useful, however, how would you tack them out? A chappy seems his strongest when given an assault squad (something I hadn't planned to use) and given the charge... The Librarian seems kind of expensive and the Commander seems... Spartan. They're all good but I don't know which one meshes best with this sort of army. Too bad you couldn't arrange Dreads into a squadron and have a Chappy lead them. xD That'd be sick. xDD
Right now, the general idea I have so far for my first collection is an HQ with a full command squad in a drop pod, two full tac squads with two special weapons in two drop pods, a Dread with Assault Cannon and DCCW in a drop pod and a whirly or two... Would that provide the kind of entry level force that I'm looking for?
That force sounds really good. However, don't be so quick to dismiss the Melta gun. Ture, it's range is limited, but that is 90% negated when drop podding. and few weapons cause as much general fear and anxiety in your opponent as a melta gun. Having a bunch of melta gun toting tac squads really makes it difficult for your opponents to effectively use his armor, since he HAS to keep it away from your squads.
As far as the HQ, your right about the chappy, Don't take him unless your taking an assult squad. Your other 2 choices are a Libby, and a Master. The Master is nice cause he is cheap. You can even give him a plasma pistal and have an extra ap-2 weapon. However, I find the Libby to be a good use of points, if you don't bog him down. I usually just take a codicier, with Fear. Only having one power REALLY cuts down on his points.
And I really like the idea of the Whirlwinds. I may have to try that.
may I sugegst that you do not go with a DP army this early on in the oint values you need mor bodies on the ground go with Tac squads one with an anti tank Heavy WEapon and a cheep captain.
That should give you enough to deal with most enemies and be balanced enough that you can pull the defensive line stand and shoot or a full out ground covering charge dependant on enemy.
"They shall all taste OBLIVION!,.....which tastes like Red Bull, which is disgusting."
Well, if I want to play a sit and shoot army, I'll bring out my IG force. xD The point of putting together this SM army was to give me something completely different from my more or less static IG army. I figured a full on deep-strike drop pod Marine army of rapid-fire and assaulty doom would be about as huge a difference as I could get and still be playin' humans (I like humans. xD)
Besides, thirty marines, a dread and a Whirly or two is a good start for a more balanced SM army later. ^^
Just looking to put together a little Drop Pod army to give me a few new toys to play with.
As for my HQ, I'm kinda imagining using a Captain or a Master to start with... Partially because in order to get a good looking librarian, I can't just buy the Command Box without substantial modification. xD Considering 90-120 of my 500-750 points is taken up by the pods themselves, I can see myself being a bit strapped for points especially if I'm taking TYBB and multiple special weapons...
Guess I should lay my hands on the Codex and I could put a real list together.
Any further suggestions?
Last edited by GunTAG; September 7th, 2006 at 19:52.
In your original post you brought up two tactics that veteran players use and that get discussed a lot. Primarily, using C&P for 2 special wpns and Libby with FotD. That was very intuitive of you. I often put meltas in my DP tac squads b/c if I can, my first target of choice is a nice juicy tank to drop by. PLUS meltas are assault weapons, so you can shoot then charge with them.Originally Posted by GunTAG
I also use at least one squad with 2 plasma guns. I will drop in under 12" from the enemy if I can, and rapid fire using the plasma to great effect, as well as using the Holy Bolters to bring retribution on the heads of the heretics and the unclean!
I suggest you give you HQ (no matter what flavor) a bolt pistol for the cheapest extra attack in the game, and possibly termintor honors for ANOTHER attack (which costs a bit more).
Another item you should strongly consider is the Landspeeder Tornado. It is VERY dynamic! It can be deep struck ( or striked??) but that round it can not shoot (per the new FAQ). You don't have to deep strike it though.
One more thing to consider. I don't like squads of 5 or 6. I like squads of 10. They last longer, I think they are more true to the fluff of SM generally speaking (I'm not a real min/maxer), and when a small squad takes a few losses, it become practically useless...
BTW, I am the opposite of you...I have been using a very dynamic SM force, and I am now building a stand and shoot IG army!!
Once a Marine, always a Marine.
Heh, well, I've been trolling about and offering my own suggestions here and there as an IG player. I have a tendency to point out armies that lists would be weak against as I find this helps you look for holes in your battle plans and plan for contingencies.Originally Posted by 4theEmperor!
Along the way I noticed a few recurring themes. Cleanse and Purify and Drop Pods, Librarian with FoD against low LD armies, etc. I'll probably have a Captain with a bolt pistol, power weapon, termihonors and maybe something to get him a decent invulnerable save along with a command squad and maybe some how cram a company champion in there. Extra cutty power for the inevitable assault. xD Though I don't know much about them. *needs to get the codex soon*
Maybe I should give my command squad the Meltas, since they're more likely to charge if I'm given the options and Meltas are assault weapons. Then I can give both the Tac Squads plasma? That'll give me an even split between stand and shoot and fire and cut.