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This is a thought I've given some time to, and, quite frankly, I like it.
Would an assaulty guard list be a viable option?
Take independent commissars and conscript platoons. Tarpits from hell. And, in regular platoons, take meltaguns.
I think that this would make a great shock tactic. Throw everybody WAY off.
As you say, by far the best close combat element to guard is the 50-man conscript platoon with an independant commissar, it is the only guard CC unit that will truly cause fear, particularly with something like close order drill to give them +1 initiative. There are a few other options though.
Veterans with carapace would be a nice assault option, they can infiltrate, the sergeant can take officer only items and the squad can take cc weapons and assault weapons. The thing is, all guard tend to be nerfed by the fact they are initiative 3, they have a tough time surviving the enemies attacks unless they are a significantly weaker race, if given grenades they work very nicley against units hogging cover.
Of course there are always options like rough riders, which can make a mess on the charge, or Orgryns which have the toughness and the wounds to take the pain (unless there is a hidden powerfist arround)!
Another option is a kitted out command squad, they can get some sweet equipment and advisors, and they can close order drill for extra initiative, but as regards wonds they are pretty thin on the ground.
Generally speaking though with guard, trying to kit units out for CC tends to be very expensive and just buys you a mediocre close combat unit that can barley give a tactical squad a run for it's money. The conscripts are your best bet if you want to make somebody sweat. Just be careful of mind war, you might want to have an expendable command squad run behind with iron discipline to keep them in line if worst comes to worst.
Thanks for replying.
I didn't know that conscripts could take Close Order Drill.
What about chimeras? Would they be able to find a place in this kind of army?
Yep, for dumping Ogryns on the field, or a suicide HQ with priest, commissar, psyker with master crafted force weapon and honorifica...
Okay, thanks again.
But now, the army runs into a problem. With all of the CC focus, what can I do about armour? Anti-Tank Support squads? Demolisher russes?
Oh, is Warrior Weapons a good idea. I think that it may make the army too expensive, and should be left for those who can play well tactically (not me).
Personally I think warrior weapons is too expensive, by the way - you might be interested in the latest Forgeworld release:
Gorgon Super-Heavy Transport
It's basically a Chimera the size of a Baneblade and it can carry a full 50-man Conscript squad. It's an expensive tank and the rules aren't out yet - but I would love to field one of these with a couple of russes to back it up. Can you imagine how devestating it would be dropping that into their lines?
As I say, I haven't seen the rules, but by the looks of it it's open topped and has a front assault ramp - so hopefully you will be able to assault out of this thing.
The one disadvantage is that they say it has a transport capacity of 50. If that is accurate then there is no room for a commissar, you would have to field a 40 man squad, but that is pretty minor I suppose.
Last edited by Xethemez; September 20th, 2006 at 14:32.
That is freakin' cool!:w00t:
I've gotta show this to my brother, thanks mate!
my vote goes for two basilisk with idirect fire (one in each corner of your deployment zone) this will let you drope two pie plates anywhere on the table... especially ontop of any unit your oponent may be hiding behind all that close combat. also by taking two and setting them up in the corners the minimum range issue is negated (aka min. range with indirect fire.
on top of that (and to finish off the heavy support options) I say an offensive demolisher (3X H.Bolters, stubber, xtra armour) that should be able to hold its own, and give another target for any units that may not be engaged in cc
I'd suggest using the Chimera for an armored fist squad. Which is just fancy talk for a squad that goes in a Chimera and counts as a core selection.
I'm building assault guard, with more emphasis on close range firepower than actual melee, but should they get charged, certain elements will do an okay job I suppose. The doctrines and skills will go a long way in determining the feasibility of melee guard.
I'd think close order drill, with hardened fighters(whatever gives +1 WS), and warrior weapons would make some tasty treats for the local genestealer cult. You'd have WS4, I4, and 2 attacks. This, my friends, is not great .. but is enough for said squad to tear up Eldar Guardians, Tau Firewarriors, Space Marine Scouts(lack of #), run of the mill Ork boyz, and could even suicide charge into better troops.
The squad leader of a Veteran squad should carry the Honorifica Imperialis (Mundanus), giving him the stats of a heroic senior officer. Oh yeah, he can also carry a powerfist. Equip the squad with warrior weapons and hardened fighters, complete with cc weapons and the like, and you'd have a decent squad. Take 3 flamers and itll become quite the kickass assault infiltration team. The powerfist seargent should carry a master crafted plasma pistol or something nice like that.
Personally, I equip them with melta-guns and a flamer, because I want multiple ways of breaking thru armor; the powerfist seargent & multiple melta-gunners. I try to balance it between shooting and melee, so the rest of the boys get shotguns and the like. The squad rarely has a weapon that can fire beyond 18", but it infiltrates and will get the job done. No heavy weapon to slow it down, and the close range potential of 3 melta-guns and 6 shotguns, or 3 flamers and 6 shotguns, will be quite devastating to enemy squads close up.
As for the command squad of doom, it's not my thing but I do field a fully mobile short range command squad. It usually consists of 2 flamers, a melta, and a regular veteran with pistol/sword or lasgun, with an HSO ready to pwn with bolt pistol/power weapon or some such.
oh yeah, my last advice is to take the Veterans doctrine allowing more Veteran squads. These can be optioned out so nicely and can infiltrate; you can put together some nice assault squads with these. Conscripts and veterans all the way, lol.
Last edited by rune; September 30th, 2006 at 15:10.
Hehehe... No. Not if you're playing against both a good opponent and a well greased army.Would an assaulty guard list be a viable option?
Why? We're slow, we're weak statwise and our transports are neither oppoened topped, fast or inexpensive. And our wargear is laughable.
An IG army with counter attack units? Yes, that is by far more viable.
... only triumph could turn pooing his pants into a good thing..