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I'm sure this debate has come up many times before, but I couldn't find anything similar, so I'm just going to ask.
Do people prefer to put their heavy anti-tank weapons like lascannons in a big infantry squad and leave heavy bolters for command squads, thus protecting their lascannons, or do they prefer to put the heavy bolters in the infantry squads and lascannons in command squads, in order to make use of the 9 lasguns in the infantry squad (rather than having them all go to waste if the squad were to shoot at a tank with a lascannon).
To me, the latter made more logical sense, as lots of people seem to talk about the effect that mass lasguns can have, but I've been told that lascannons should be protected by full infantry squads.
Heavy weapons platoons could be added to this argument as well, as these are a third place that the heavy weapons can appear, but I have no idea what to be putting where. Likewise, I'm not sure where autocannons would go if I were to include them...
Actually, as some of the guard players here on this board will tell you; they don't generally put a heavy weapon on their command squads. (Some guard players do, caring less for the leadership bubble(s) for various reasons.)
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I am a proponent of HW Lascannon Squads for the following reasons:
1> Focused fire. You DO waste Lasrifle shots when you shoot your squad Lascannon at a tank. Not that massed Lasgun fire is the most effect tool, it isn't, but in the end it is all about percentages, and the more guns you shoot at the enemy the better. You can also waste the Special weapon shooting at a Tank. Even a Plasma gun is wasted vs AV14.
2> My experience has shown that you can protect your HW squadds. By proper placement of the HW squads in cover, and by placement of other squads in front of them, you can usually protect them.
3> Weapon price: Lascannons are the same price in HW squads, but all others are 5 points more.
4> It is easy to put them in range of your JO - HSO with Iron Discipline to keep them from running. Leadership is very important to guard units.
I look at it this way. What would I rather have as an inti-tank unit, a three Lascannon HW team that includes 6 troops, or a troop squad that has one Lascannon and one Plasma gun for almost the same price?
There are some IG Generals whom I respect that will disagree with me, but that is my two bits....
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I think he's talking more about putting Lascannons in Command Squads, not the support teams.I am a proponent of HW Lascannon Squads for the following reasons:
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When you get into the realm of what heavy weapon goes where and similar discussion about guard, positioning and tactics in game become much more important than the list. Your rational sounds good, so just give it a try and see if it works. If you find that your command gets blown to pieces and you have no leadership or that the more effiencient use of lasfire isn't helping that much, switch your stuff out.
Command Squads should never have lascannons, killing our officers and destroying our leadership bubbles is the quickest way to cripple a guard infantry army. Putting a lascannon in a command squads just makes that squad an even more desirable target.
Command Squads are there for leadership, the better it is at providing leadership the more it should stay hidden. I run 3 sorts of command squads, the first one being a HSO with ID, Standard and a Mortar. Ld9/reroll with ID is just awesome for keeping your troops in the trench but this squad is also a top target, hence I need to hide it out of LOS to keep it alive.
The Second one consists of a JO with HI and ID along with another Mortar team, this squad might not have the reroll, but it's still good at keeping your troops where they should be.
Any following command squads I field are a JO with ID and a heavy bolter or sometimes an autocannon. They're not considered that much of a threat, so a cheap heavy weapon won't draw any noticable ammounts of fire.
Lascannons should stay in Anti-tank Support Squads or Infantry Squads. As for which is best there, well... there's several pros and cons for each listed by the members above, so there's no reason for me to copy paste their replies. :>
You make excellent points Kaiser, about lascannons making leadership squads attractive. So no more lascannons in command squads. On the other hand, I still do like the idea of being able to use the lasguns, so I might have a look at creating an anti-tank heavy support squad attached to the HQ Command squad.
For those that use anti-tank squads, how do you protect them? It seems to me that if they're in a position to get good fire lanes, that they'll get shot up. It may take a few more rounds if they're in cover, but they're still just 6 guardsmen. Is that considered an acceptable loss if the enemy long range weapons are targeting them instead of your tanks? Are there other ways to protect them?
Sit them in cover, sit them as far back as possible and let their long range work for them.
You shouldn't expect this unit to survive to the end of the battle. However they pack a Large amount of weaponary, so expect them to do their job within one or two turns. If they blow up even just one tank, they've likely made their points right back already.
... only triumph could turn pooing his pants into a good thing..
i never put heavies in command squads, as i want them mobile or outside LoS.
i have the majority of my lascannons in my linesquads as i experianced them to die rather quickly if in heavy weapon squads only. however, i do have 3 lascannons in a heavy weapon squad which is light infantery and can therefor infiltrate. this way i can position it into cover, hence increasing its survivability. and as i am positioning it after the enemies deployment, i can choose LoS most of the time.