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in 1000 pts, is a multi-melta speeder, 3 bikes with 2 melta guns, and a vindicator enough anti armour? i'm just finalising a list and want to make sure i'm covered in that department. its for an all-comers list. thanks.
I really wouldn't count a Vindy as anti-armor unless you were out of targets or desperate. The MM and meltas are very short-ranged. Are they in the same unit? If so, you'll be in big trouble if they get wiped out early.
What does the rest of your army look like?
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well, for starters, the vindi, often gets overlooked when it comes to anti-armour. with str 10. and 2d6 ap (ordnance), it is a match for all armour. the speeder is on its own, and the bikes form one squad. the rest of the army, is as follows:
cheap captain with power weapon, termie honours, stuborn and a bolt pistol (possibly basic chaplain),
dread with extra armour,
2 lots of six marines with a plasma cannon each,
8 scouts with sniper rifles, and a heavy bolter,
6 marines with a melta gun,
speeder with multi melta,
3 bikes, 2melta guns,
the hero either hangs around, or teams up with the melta marines to go for a prowl. i should also mention, that its a DA army.
ok the rules of anti armour
Generally anti armour needs to work fast (turn 1) and with a high degree of certainty
This leads people towards things like predetor annihs with las cannon sponsons as it has superb range, 3 chances to hit, one with a reroll and can penetrate any armour, indeed for my money it is the premium tank hunter
the vindicator has a number of flaws (one chance to hit, poor range) but its real problem is that its ideal target is expensive units rather than tanks
Equally melta guns suffer from the range issue, multui meltas fair better but with a single shot you can miss, or take the TLLC off for example a pred annih who can still bop stuff with 2 las cannon
so your list still lacks a truely efficient and efective tank hunter, particularly against skimmer based armies where your one shot but pretty sure of penetrating gets nerfed to glancing
there is no standard generic template for AT, if you encounter a foot based army, then your points spent on AT can be wasted and better to waste the points of the land speeder with multi melta than the pred annih with LC sponsons
I would suggest that a better way to introduce AT to your army is to get a couopel of Razors with TLLC for your tac sqsuads, but you would probably have to loose 2 of the vindi, bikes and land speeder to get them
Everything you have been told is a lie!
At 1000 points, you don't have a lot of anti-armour options, generally speaking, unless you are playing a Drop Pod army. Melta weapons just won't cut it. In general, standard anti-armour as seen by most Warhammer players works as such:
- Long Range, to maximise the number of turns firing at the tank.
- High Strength, to maximise the chances of damaging the tank.
- Low AP, 1 if possible, to further increase the chances of destroying the tank.
You likely won't need much as tanks are a rare sight in semi-competitive environments, while they are much more common in highly competitive ones. There are few armies that don't have the ability to field tanks at a 1000 point level but some, like Eldar, will rely on them more than others. When their tanks are highly mobile, deployment and range of weapons becomes important as they are generally going to be static, especially when mounted on infantry. That said, there are three general options that Space Marine commanders can go for when taking anti-tank weapons, as laid down by the blessed Chaosbrynn (:tongue:
5 Tactical Marines w/Lascannon - A cheap and rather efficient squad by itself, often combined with a Plasma Gun to provide extra fire support and somewhat increased flexibility but it doesn't have to be.
6 Devastator Marines w/3 Missile Launchers - A much more dedicated anti-armour option although slightly scaled down at 1000 points; the original is 8 with 4 missile launchers. They have the added benefit of being effective against both light infantry and Tyranid Monstrous Creatures as well, provided that they don't take Extended Carapace.
Predator Annihilator/Destructor w/Lascannon Sponsons, Extra Armour, Power of the Machine Spirit (optional) - With three Lascannons or two and an Autocannnon mounted on a heavily armoured gun platform, this option makes an attractive target that must be well deployed in order to fully take advantage of it. I honestly don't use it very much myself because it is, for all intents and purposes, a tank and they can be so fragile sometimes...
Generally I try and do a combination of Lascannon squads and Devastator squads for my anti-armour, making sure not to take too many of each. Generally at 1000 points you'll see about two Lascannons and one Devastator Squad with the rest of the army fulfilling an infantry killing role.
well, my other option is a las-missile dread, but if there isn't much armour, then its a waste, but the speeder can be used to claim objectives on the last turn. the same goes for the bikes.
i'm thinking most armies in 1000 pts, are going to only have 2 tanks max, and any other armour will be fairly weak.
The LC/ML dread is effective at AT particularly if you consider it disposable (provided it takes out its own points worth of tanks then fine)
Everything you have been told is a lie!
The Multi-Melta Land Speeder is actually something I hadn't considered before. While it only has one shot, it is very much a mobile form of anti-tank that could hit the side armour of tanks given proper deployment/terrain. However, for them to be truly effective you have to have a few more of them and you can't rely on them to be your only anti-tank option, especially when they compete with Land Speeder Tornados for Fast Attack slots. Also, I forgot to mention that Ordnance does not actually roll 2d6 for armour penetration (be careful about that distinction). That said, their penetrating hit table is more spectacular but I think you've heard all of the arguments from Cheredanine of why it's not good to use a Vindicator for this purpose.
well yeah, you roll 2d6 and pick the highest, which is still pretty good.