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okay this is my first post, so plz dont hurt me!
I had a 2 on 1 game on the weekend. Daemonhunters(500), BT(500) vs Eldar (1000) and we got totally demolished. Of course it was the first time we even played eldar but i don't think it made a difference.
Here's a run down of what we fielded
Inq lord + Ret
1x psycannon, 1x plasma cannon 2x heavy bolter
Our game plan was to use callidus' word in your ear to move reapers behind terrain to buy 2 turns or so from Ap3 death, the callidus would then arrive from reserve and casually poke them with a ctan stick. While this was happening we would unload 7 plasma and 3 las cannon shots on the 2 (vectored engined, holo fielded) falcon and wave serpent that were carrying 10 banshees and some dire avengers. Assuming the vehicles were destroyed we would then focus everything on the avatar.
14 plasma and 6 las cannon shots later...the banshees unloaded on our lines and the avatar did its thing ....'nuff said. (at least the callidus killed the reapers)
Now how the hell do you kill those damned Eldar machines?? or how do YOU kill them?
I hope my dark eldar would fare better...
Argh, where are your Grey Knights? I find your lack of faith disturbing...
I would have just ignored the Tanks, Also maybe layering your squads with the 2 IST squads out from to buy time for the BT player to do whatever he could.
But in general Eldar tanks are nasty, in some cases even worse than Tau. I've found teh best way is to just keep hitting it, eventually something will happen.
In 500 points I'd take a full GK squad (no special weapons) a BC and however many ISTs you can get with the left over points...which is 2 squads of 6 with 2 Plasmas each, put the GK out front and the ISTs right behind and March them forward, have the BT player concentrate of teh DarkReapers and Avatar first, While teh ISTs target tanks and troops if you can't damage it, the GK's Storm Bolters would lay waste to howling banshees if they can get a roun of shooting in first and rock socks in CC.
But then again I'm just that Crazy GK guy!
No no, don't get me wrong i'm usually a pure GK player, i just thought this situation called for a static shooting army.
I guess it sounds easier said than done, but i had no choice but to shoot at his tanks as 2/3 of his army were inside them. It was hard for me not to use GK's but i knew he would use Reapers as he assumed he was power armoured armies. So with the 150 points left over i used a callidus instead to specifically combat the threat of the reapers.
Oh, and i didnt get to shoot at all at his banshees because he moved his waveserpent close enough to charge(you could imagine how much fire power i poured into it before)
Maybe next time i'll try bringing more plasma
Most eldar tanks are armour x so with enough psycanon shots u should
get some 6s....
anyhow why not use the callidus vs the back of his tank the template should mess up his plans and u may actually get lucky trying to assault the back door although this is not a great plan obviously. better with eversor if u can get him in the right spot
XXXPlease dont post statsXXX
Last edited by Cheredanine; March 20th, 2007 at 14:21.
Difficult little bugger to kill, eh?
Since alsmost always they are moving, all hits will be Glancing, and they usually get to re-roll bad damage table results, you will need a lot of shots to kill these. The best weapons are Autocannons, but we don't have them in our army very much, so the next best thing is Psycannons. A mini Purgation squad (troops squad with two Psycannons + =][= with Psycannon), or a full Purgation squad are the way to go. The TLLC/ML dreads are also very good as well.
You can go with the strategy of ignoring them, but they can pack a whack of firepower, and usually they have a "Nasty" squad like Firedragons in them, so I recommend trying to kill it. I played a game on the weekend vs Eldar, and I shot at a Falcon with Holofield, Stones and Vectored engines every turn and only managed to Immobilize it.:cry:
The only solice to take, is that Falcon costs as much as a Landraider!
"A love for tradition has never weakened a nation, indeed it has strengthened nations in their hour of peril."
Sir Winston Churchil
ok well I am no expert with Demon hunters, but with Eldar:
1. Tanks, as others have said in one fasion or the other, Edar tanks are different to others their armour is weaker, but they are more resilient, the trick is the number of shots rather than high strength, Not sure about specific weapons of GK/DH but generally auto cannon, assault cannon, that sort of thing are your best friend (rather perversely the scatter laser is probably one of the best), Dreads with assault cannon?
2. Banshees in a serpent: bear in mind that he can not charge the turn he gets out of his serpent unless it stays stationary, so I am assuming he moved, then you had your turn, then he got out and charged, his total range is 13-18 inches for that charge move, this means he has to be very precise, if he gets too close, you can move up and block his egress (way out for the under educated) if he is too far away, he wont reach you, if he is within 6 inches of being too far away, you can simply move back away from his tank, adding a further 6 inches to the range, dont forget he doesnt choose that varriability in his range, it is decided by those magicall little cubes, so to be certain, he needs to stop his transport with its back end about 8-10 inches from you. Drop back - suddenly he cant gaurentee that even with FOF he will reach, move something fast up (for my money Land speeder tornadoes are the dogs whatsits for this, blocks him getting out and gives you 7 shots at his rear armour, but I suspect this is not an option for you. Put a dread in the front line, assault cannon followed by charge on the tank, even after that, unless the exrach has an excutioner, he cant hurt it, and to be honest, even if he does have an executioner, his chances are not high
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i think the whole "lets take some ubertanks against 2 seperate 500pt force organization charts" is a bit rich. then again, you could take 4 HQs i 'spose.......
dont really have anything to say, its 500 pts, and cant really squeeze in much against that scum xeno vehicle. psycannons, yeah, i like that idea.... try =I= with psycannons. 3 of 'em. then you can hide and shoot.
better yet, tell your mate to take change the lascannons to misslelaunchers, and swap a crusader unit to scout unit w/ misslelaunchers. that'll save some points for stuff.
it was mentioned here than you'll only glance anyways, and i think taking more stuff + =I='s w/ psycannons should comphensate for the lascannon D5+ to damage armour instead of the Misslelaunchers D6+ to damage....
thunderhammer! if you hit, that'll stop it for a while... maybe on a cheap character w/bike or something... but then you need to actually get to it, let alone hit the damn things...:cry:
as i said, its difficult for 500pts, but as diggims said, luckily those couple of tanks are nearly the equal of Land Raiders in cost
hope you "kill" this problem haha good luck!
LO RULESOriginally Posted by Jaffar_Hasad
Honestly, I think your biggest issue was springing for the Callidus assassin. That's almost too expensive even for a regular 1000 pt list, let alone for a 500 pt force. Furthermore, playing a single Force Org chart against two smaller Force Orgs is an unfair fight, no matter who's playing whom. In my own gaming group, we've gotten away from doing that when we have an odd number of opponents and let the double-team use a single Force Org chart. Unfluffy much of the time, but it makes for a superior game, and that's what matters, yes? I would recommend you do that from now on.
As for how to kill Eldar tanks -- you can't. Really, you just can't. Kind of like the Necron monolith, the fact that the tanks are awesome and dangerous doesn't automatically mean you should concentrate on them. I'd target Eldar tanks only if I had no other valid targets. The problem is that, once fully upgraded, your odds of actually destroying the bugger is only 1:36. And it's not that much better to get any meaningful result at all (immobilized, weapon destroyed, stunned). So I'd say do your best to ignore them and concentrate on everything else the Eldar have brought to the table. Focusing all your efforts into removing an Eldar tank just plays into their hands.
ninjabackhand: point and click, again, really? even after i give you an military term "shock tactic" you still call it point and click.
RIP Warhammer 40,000: 21 Sep 1998 - 24 May 2014
Like Cheredanine said, AssCans or AutoCans are the way to go against those ugly skimmers. Coincidentally, you can get both of those on a dread! Either would do the trick, but the AssCan is probably more universally useful of the two. Since you know where the wave serpent is heading (straight into your lines with the banshees), it shouldn't be too hard to position the dread where it'll have a chance to unload on that wave serp. You could pop a smoke launcher on him if you're concerned about return fire (see how he likes getting only glancing hits!). Ah, and also, even with an executioner sword, that banshee exarch won't be able to hurt the dread. It doesn't double her strength, if I recall correctly, but rather adds one less than her strength, so she should be one point shy of being able to hurt him. In this case, I'd keep the DCCW rather than the ML, since it's pretty likely he could end up in combat, and this keeps your dread cheap enough that you could swap the dread for the assassin, and away you go!
But I think the problem here, number6, is that a good portion of this guys list is tied up in the two tanks. Wave Serpent + Banshees and Falcon + Dire Avengers accounts for most of his list at 1000 points, I'd think. So, in this case, they didn't have very much else to shoot at! Ah well, c'est la vie.
Last edited by Hasten; March 20th, 2007 at 16:48.
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Agree with hasten's edit, the core of the eldar army is eaten by two vehicles and their occupants, if you can stop the vehicles, causing the opponents to spill out under your guns, then you have won, it is rather customising your force to deal with one army but squeeze in 2 dreads with assault cannons, you should take out one, possibly even both tanks and allow you to spray the occupants with fire. Unfortunatley whilst this sounds well and good, in all probability you just move the goal posts, instead of moving close he will stand off and try and remove the dreads, your foot army will end up chasing skimmers round the table, trying to get within the range for your dreads, which means table size and cover becomes a strong factor
Everything you have been told is a lie!