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My friend keeps kicking my butt with his marine force ( . I was wondering if anyone has some useful sudjestions?
It may help if you can detail what he has, what you have and what happens, in the mean time, bumped to IG forum, this is for Tactica documents
Everything you have been told is a lie!
Leman russ tanks are ok against light troops but are great at popping space marines out of there shells. Take 3 if your playing at 1500 and just keep them alive while they blast away.
Infantry with a Plasma gun and heavy bolter work well when facing marine squads and missile launchers double as a good anti-tank weapon and also act as a long range plasma gun.
Target there assault squads first with any weapon you can bring to bear as these guys can cut up your men faster then a guardsman wastes his paycheck on carapace armour.
Try to get into a shooting match with him and watch out for landspeeders taking pot shots at your tanks side armour. Cut off the most likely area your enemy assault troops will take to get to you. Lots of cover on your left? You can bet the assault squad will try to close on you in this area so try to get a few squads with good line of sight on this area. Deep stiking veteran squads with 3 plasma guns will really mess up any marine squad they land next too and there cheap to coming in at around 15 points.
Keep in cover if you can, as all his guns will rip through your armour.
Try to keep him from getting into close combat with you.
Bring lots of very big guns to the table.
Pray for luck as you'll need it. Marine's can have a run of bad-luck and recover - the Guard can't.
So my humble Guardsman's fist is as strong as a blast from his laser rifle?
There are two main principles fighting MEQ's (just a slight expansion on KOS-MOS's comments).
1. You *have* to keep them at range.
2. Put your infantry against his vehicles, and your tanks against his infantry. Your infantry have numbers on their side against his fewer vehicles, your tanks have range on his infantry.
While you're doing this, most marine players want to put their infantry against yours, and their armour against yours. Avoid this at all costs.
Target transports and assault squads first with your infantry heavy weapons first, then the speeders / bikes that can cut up your tanks.
Tanks stay out of range or LOS of Dev squads, or the 5 man squads with lascannons, and either continue to go for transports etc, or go for the Dev squads. Put a hill between you and the nearest unit, then fire lengthways down the board at units that don't have the range to fire back at you. You will outnumber him badly, so something like Sentinels are esp good for transport hunting : he's only got a few units to shoot with, so make him choose between too many potential threats. Some of your units will get die, but you have numbers on your side.
Rough riders, or deep striking vets/stormies are fantastic at cutting up any deep striking Terminators. When he strikes he'll rarely waste the first turn of shooting on your RR's, but will go for your LR's or Bassies. Or keep some platoon HQ's nearby with more plasma / melta guns to counter any Termie deep strikes. Drop podding units can be rapid fired to death. Even units of 2-3 marines are still a threat to heavy weapon teams etc, but it may be worth tying them up for 1-2 turns by sacrificing an infantry squad.
Cheap power swords are prob worth it on vet sargeants in extermis, but don't waste points on other HtH specialist or equipment (priests, commissars, powerfists etc).
Hope this helps.
first off vet sarges in noraml squads cant take powerswords, dont think you meant them but i just wanted to clarify.
Squad set up is important,
plasma and heavy bolter is the ultimate anti marine set up in a squad
also good doctrines are close order drill, and light infantry.
COD drill gives them a nasty shock as they hit at the same time as you even if you arent in cover (if you arent why not get nack to them trees!) light infantry lets you set up the units second so you can react to his assault units or other main deployments it means you can set up a good reinforcement plan.
As already mentioned counter assault is rough riders and platoon commands. A platooncommand with a bunch of flamers close order and an honorifica JO with powersword works wonders. esp if in a chimera with a multilas and flamer. they can counterattack and actually win in combat. (sheer number of saves i took a charge from elite slaanesh marines few bad rolls on both sides but the flamers really dented him and i didnt even shoot the chimera!)
H vet squad with three plasma and 5 men dropping in for 75 points is a bargain.
sentinels are also fun to drop in. they will get rid of his tanks really quickly and for their price are the best antiamarine weapon. careful they die damned quick though. spread out as much as is viableaswell this will make his marines have to move all over especially the assault ones. tie ythem up for a turn in combat and they lose enough time that they dont make their points back.
As for tanks, the three russ setup is good although i prefer to have at least one bassie. marines cant get to these on turn one or even turn 2 if protected. they are the bane of assault marines aswell. you will probably find most marine players avoid cover with assault squads so they dont have to take the tests for jumping into and out of terrain etc they then are prime targets for the bassie.
Weapons wise for the points
multilasers are the best for theor points at killing marines with the same chance
heavy bolters are next only a tad behind
everything else is dubious at best apart from flamers. some say no but in select suicide squads in chimeras they are amazing. if you can get enough marines under the plate they are actually better than plasma!
Hope that helps
Can someone explain to me why heavy bolters are better at popping marines than missile launchers? I thought that the was a thread just recently that decided the "more shots vs. ap2-3" debate in favor of the lower ap weapons. I might be wrong, but i thought that the weapons without ap 3 or better just didn't work out as well as many people think. Mathhammer would be greatly appreciated if you're going to tell me otherwise.
On beating marines: I've found that nothing is scarier than multiple leman russes staring down a marine player. At my game store there seems to be a plethora of marine players or necrons ( god i hate 3+ saves) and I've found that they will hide their units rather than reveal them to battle cannon fire. I've found that setting the tanks up to see the most desirable advancement routes will force the marines into fire lanes that you can take advantage of with your many guns. And if they decide to waltz into LOS of a battle cannon then you can gleefully pick up the ordinance template and explode some power armor.
All the tips so far seem awesome. Keep em coming I could use the help too.
I'm working on my first vet squad (3plas 1 lascannon) and my 2nd russ just came in the mail today (I've been borrowing someone else's) so I'll let you know how I fare.
Well the missile launcher can also be used to take out enemy tanks and also has the range over the heavy bolter so its more flexible in the targets it can bring down. Of course theres no need to choose between them so try to aim for a mix of heavy weapons with only a few lascannons just in case.
First, rid your army of Grenade Launchers, Flamers and Autocannons.
Anti-Tank squads with 3 x Lascannons for tanks and Termies.
Infantry squads with Missle Launchers and Plasma Guns, a couple with Heavy Bolters and Plasma Guns
Dropping or Driving Command Squads with 4 Plasmas
Grenadier Squads with two Plasma
3 x Vet Squads with Lascannon and 2 or three Plasma Guns
2 x Russ
1 x Bassilisk.
Vs Marines you CANNOT take too much Plasma
That ought to do it...........
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