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Here is a new unit concept for review...it's an amalgamation of the Celestians, Repentia Mistress and Seraphim concepts into a restricted 0-1 close-combat style unit. Let me know what you think.
Sisters of Antiquity - Elite - Restricted 0-1 per army
Sister of Antiquity
S 3(4) (power neural whips add +1)
I 4(5) (power neural whips add +1)
A 1(2) (1 base, +1 for 2 cc weapons in assualt)
VSS of Antiquity
S 3(4) (power neural whips add +1)
I 4(5) (power neural whips add +1)
A 2(3) (2 base, +1 for 2 cc weapons in assualt)
Sisters of Antiquity are the most venerable, pious and faithful sisters who are entrusted with their Order's few suits of Artificier Armour bestowed upon each Priory by order of the Emperor himself.
Squad: The squad consists of 1 Veteran Sister of Antiquity and between 4 and 9 Sisters of Antiquity
Weapons: Sisters of Antiquity carry into battle a pair of wrist-mounted bolt-pistols and a matched pair of annointed 'Blade-Whips'
Annointed Blade-Whips - Are power-bladed Neural-Whips that add +1 to Str and +1 to Init. They are a matching pair of single-handed weapons, confering the additional +1 bonus to CC attacks. No other attack benefits are recieved in CC from any other weapons.
Options: Up to two Sisters of Antiquity may be armed with wrist-mounted flame-pistols (firing as a normal flamer) at +5 pts, wrist-bolters (as twin-linked bolt-pistols) at +5 points, or wrist-mounted inferno pistols at +15 pts (fires as a twin-linked Inferno Pistol).
The squad may be equipped with frag grenades at an additional cost of +1 pt per model, and krak grenades at an additional cost of +2 pts per model.
The Veteran Sister of Antiquity must be upgraded to a Veteran Sister Superior for an additional cost of +10 pts. She may be given any equipment allowed from the Witch Hunters Armoury.
One Sister of Antiquity in the squad not equiped with special weapons may be upgraded to an Imagifer at the cost of +15 points. An Imagifer carries a Simulacrum Imperialis.
Adepta Sororitas: Sisters of Antiquity are subject to all the special rules detailed in Codex: Witch-Hunter.
Faithful: Sisters of Antiquity are Faithful, regardless of the presence of a Faithful character. Each squad's presence adds +2 to the army's Faith Point total.
If all members of the squad should perish the army's faith point total is reduced by -1.
Holy Hatred: When in close combat with any enemy with a WS attribute, Sisters of Antiquity hit on a 3+ regardless of respective Weapon Skill values. This advantage does not apply if the enemy is an independent character or Monstrous Creature. [This is identical to the Preferred Enemy special rule, but applies to everyone]
Transport / Deployment
Sisters of Antiquity normally deploy onto the battlefield via Grav-Chutes from an Arvis light transport allowing them to utilize the 'Deep Strike' rules. As such the Sisters of Antiquity will always begin the game in reserve..
Last edited by Inquisitor_Eljer; September 26th, 2007 at 23:10. Reason: Formatting, Transport option, point reduction...
Looks like a fairly cool unit - what's their point cost?
I don't know about a unit of 2-wound sisters though... and especially not a VSS with 3-wounds.
Oh, and they need a transport option... Rhino/Immolator.
1) Forget the 2 wounds and the plus +1 str. Instead give them eviserators! give the standard sister 2 attacks and a 2 plus save and either a jump pack or a transport. Land Raider anyone? make them 35-40 points and you've got a spearhead elite sisters unit.
The +1 Str is there to help them wound a bit more and I was going more for a quick & agile feel for the Sisters of Antiquity instead of a slow and ponderous one. Hence the Power Neural Whips route. I was trying to make a unit that would get in a decent number of attacks at a quick initiative, and yet not be over-balanced or out of flavor for the sisters. I was kinda pushing it with the close-combat themed unit of sisters instead of a 'freak show' unit.
No jump-packs...they aren't Seraphim...transport...maybe. Points are slated to be 40 for a 'normal' Sister of Antinquity and 45 for a VSS version.
SoB aren't Super-human (for the most-part) just highly-skilled. So you need to keep their base strength/toughness to the normal level, unless there is good fluff to back up why that is. So that was a good choice to re-edit them and clever to use the weapons as strength boosts instead.
Everything else is good pretty much. I'd increase the squad size to nine (ten including the VSS) and knock off ten points or so. @ forty points you're looking at something on level with a Grey Knight Terminator so as your stats and equipment are now I'd lower the price to around 25pts.
Kinda puts Celestians to shame and waste, unless you're looking for a cheaper alternative to these but I like it.
I was trying to keep them as a small 'elite' unit and the holiest of numbers is 7, which I know is 'odd', but it struck me as a good number.
Normal SM Termies are 40 pts, GK Termies are more. They may yet be a touch high on the point-scale, but I didn't want to under-price them. I figured the cost of Celestian is 13, add 20 for Artificier Armor, add 10 for 2 power weapons (which also add Str & Init), and you're at 43...seemed a little high so I toned them down to 40.
One of the other posters suggested 35 / 40 which I like, but that could be low given these ladies are faithful, have Holy Hatred, wield 2 power weapons at +1 Str & +1 Init, and have a 2+ armor save that they could turn invulnerable through an act of faith. People might yell CHEESE at that.
I was basically trying to position these as the next progression of Sisters advancement...
Battle Sister Superior
Veteran Sister Superior
Seraphim Sister Superior
Celestian Sister Superior
Sister of Antiquity
And the shouldn't take the place of Celestian directly...instead of a transport I was considering giving them a 'grav-chute' type of deployment option. A one-time deep-strike kind of thing...If I did go the transport route I'd give them the Repressor and up their squad size to 9 / 10.
Kinda puts Celestians to shame and waste, unless you're looking for a cheaper alternative to these but I like it.[/QUOTE]
I would still prefer a Canoness/Celstians H.Q., but these antiquity chicks would out class Repentias as an assault force and with armor would have a hell of a lot better chance of living to arrive at the kill zone! (Not to be confused with 'calzone', which we save for after the fight!)
I'm always screwing up the quote thing. . .I don't get it!
But I love your deep strike idea as my sisters are sick of having that done to them by a bunch of jock-jerk Space marines!!!!!!
"All I need is a few tasty waves, a cool buzz, and I'm fine!"
Abaddon the Despoiler
I'm not sold. edit : although by the end of the post i came around a bit
at first i was thinking that it is too many points, but i guess it isn't all that bad considering that you can get a lightning claws terminator for about the same price, mind you the added init, is a bit of a worry, along with the always wounds on 3+ and the fact that with an imagifyer you could have a 2++ save for nigh the who game! this is not to mention what happens if you put a priest with this squad...
this squad will murder terminators, and indeed, all things MEQ.
so, how do you balance that? no range (almost) and a complete lack of transport options, is the only thing that isn't souped about this squad, and are it's ONLY pit falls. Unless you count the faith eatage of it, as you will probably want to use about 6-9 faith points in a 6 turn game, purely on the martyr. But they will be MASSIVE fire magnets, so that basically counter balances the weight of the faith eatage. the only thing playing in your opponents favour is that you have to declare martyr at the start of a shooting phase, and hence might waste some faith, but hay, if this unit gets there...
i'm kind of circling myself here, but i don't care, there are many different angles. but on with the show.
it will not be so useful in a mech list, as it won't be able to support the rhinos very well, which is a good negative, but it would make a good second wave, especially if the enemy are assaulty (i'd like to see them vs genestealers, two massive powerhouses).
in a foot slogging army, which is currently a bit underpowered they would gel perfectly, as they would make great countercharge units, and big magnets to take away from sisters being shot at, and will last capslock-ly well, even though they take away from the firepower of such a list.
in a arco-repentia-engine list they would just add to the expensive units that tumble slowly across the board at the enemy, but with a bit more staying power than most. in this case you might be a little low on faith, and hence they won't work as well for as long, but don't let that stop you, they will stil last 2 turns on faith, so that should give you almost enough time to get your arcos there, and thats when the fun starts.
ok, i'm coming around to these guys, still not sure about the points, but the more i think about it the closer they are. they also gel quite well iwth the army, and make a bit of fluff sense.
whether i'd play *against* them...not sure, but i like the idea and i might give them a shot
Last edited by Splata; June 4th, 2007 at 02:07.
I was considering a special rule for the whips...instead of the +1 Str maybe on a to-wound roll of a 6, 1 opposing model's attack profile is reduced to 1 because they're entangled in the whip?
The essence I'm going for here is an elite, agile unit with unique weapons and armor focused on, but not dedicated to CC / Assault. They should get a good number of attacks, but with average (3 or 4) Str to make wounding a challenge. I felt the Sister's needed a single unit that could be decent in CC / Assault and also act in a counter-assault type role.
As for the transport, maybe it should be something along these lines...
Grav-chute deployment is an additional 3 (or 5?) points per model, or the unit can add a Repressor transport as per the IA2 entry? Thoughts?
My last questions are specifically for balance...
1) Would you field these girls as described above? If not, why?
2) Would this new unit 'break' the flavor of the SoB? If so, why?
3) Would this new unit over-power or carry a game on their own in your opinion?
Thanks for your input everyone!