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I'm playing a game on saturday 2000 pts Ultramarines vs Tau, and I want to use my Veterans as I bought the box to paint a while ago but haven't gamed with them. I know they aren't the most popular choice for SM Players but I want to give them a chance to prove themselves.
I'll be using the 5 out of the box with the given weapons options plus possibly another 3 with BPs & CCWs that I made up for my command squad.
I was wondering if people thought I would be better of bunging them in a Rhino / Razborback (depending on numbers) and giving them Furious Charge, or just giving them Infiltrate instead.
I may also put a Chaplain in with them for the old Litanies of Hate bonus, but then I need HQ slots for my Jump Pack Chaplain and Deathwatch squad so maybe not.
I welcome any advice :-)
(If this should be in the army list section my apologies, I just figured it was more of a query than a list for assessment).
Your judgment's fine. The Army List section is for actual lists.
Infiltrate is (in my opinion) a far better way of getting them closer to the enemy, but in order for it to work without them getting shot to pieces you need some support. Otherwise, what inevitably happens is that every short-ranged weapon in your enemy's arsenal fires point-blank on your very expensive five-man squad. Even if you're in cover, that's not something you'll expect to get through.
The Rhino isn't much better, since it'll likely get immobilised very quickly or else destroyed, risking your men getting entangled and then shot at by whatever squad hit the Rhino. The safest method for transporting a Veteran squad is by Land Raider. It's also hideously expensive.
As long as you can support them when they infiltrate - Scouts come to mind as a cheap and numerous option - or ensure their survival through other means, it's probably the best way to get them there. Don't go Rhino. Driving Rhinos up against Tau is comparable to throwing potatoes in front of a gatling gun.
The above poster = Totally a member of the Fluff Masters Clan. Click here for fluff pwnage.
Come, sons of LO! Kneel before Poodle!
Mr_Wayne: "Some people believe that the World Eaters do not field any ranged weaponry. Those people often die at a distance."
Hmm that's quite a good idea, I have some scouts with BPs & CCWs that I can use to support them, though I also have a 10-man set of snipers I fancy could work wonders against crisis suits... hadn't thought of that!
I know what you mean about the vehicles though, I try to avoid taking them against Tau, even my everpresent dread is going to be absent this time, as they simply have too many nasty guns available. I remebmer the first time I played them watching the battlesuits with jump jets running rings around my terminators while taking AP2 potshots at them (
I was also wondering about how best to deploy the Deathwatch (10 man, 2 HBs, Kraken Rounds, Librarian) - I was thinking if I deep strike them within rapid fire range the AP4 goodness will decimate from the first turn, and I know they are going to become my opponents' "unit to kill" as soon as they make an entrance!
You fell into the same trap I did: bought the box cuz it looked kewl. That was one of the first (and, it turns out, the worst) purchases I made. I learned a hard lesson then, that the metal box sets often do NOT offer the best gaming units. :x
I also learned another harsh lesson: Infiltrate, infiltrate, infiltrate! I tried these guys twice, once in a Rhino, once in a razorback. The Rhino (vs. Space Wolves) got popped first turn and I was forced to footslog toward his firing line. I couldn't shoot (too far away), but might have made it into close combat if it weren't for his intercepting dread. That was, um, messy. :x
The second time was against Tau. Popped the Razorback like a tin can an inch out of my deployment zone. Entangled everyone, and the unit never really fully recovered. Too far from the action, they never fired a shot, and never made it into close combat. Talk about a wasted unit!
If I EVER run these guys again (and that's a big if... I'll make new models for 'em first!), they will infiltrate or use a drop pod. If you're gonna infiltrate, try using your Deep striking Deathwatch crew to distract from them, or give them a homer to guide the DW in. Course, scouts do this just as easily, and for fewer points. I think, overall, they are more useful in objective-based games. Infiltrate or pod in close to the objective, and get into cover. If you're careful with them, they can be quite the thorn in your enemy's side. Course, if you're not careful, they'll either be an expensive waste, or worse, a quick and costly snack for your opponent.
Heh I was never under too much of an illusion - they are the last type of marine unit I've bought, got at least 2 of everything else :-P
I think Infiltration will definitely be the way to go, hopefully with the amount of stuff that will be halfway across the table in my first turn or so they should be in line with everything else!
I do want to try drop pods but I can't bring myself to proxy... can't wait for the plastics to come out!
Shame veterans can't have jump packs really, I always thought they were a little inflexible, for a supposedly "Elite" unit they are a bit mediocre, they had the potential to be awesome - furious charge power weapons and jump packs, or tank hunters with 4 lascannons... but not to be it seems.
The new version of the unit the DA have are a little bit better, will be nice when we get a codex update so we can have all those options as well!
Actually I haven't bought the box and from what I hear I won't... I made from my spare bits a full 10-man Veteran Squad...
I played only one game with them due to the points... and I used Infiltrate. They won a whole table quarter all by themselves... So I cannot be objective as I have used only one option! I would definitely recommend Infiltrate!
Thanks to all the people showing faith in me
I sometimes feel that everyone will leave me and they will be on their own...
I often do that myself thanks to the versatility of the more recent plastics, but I liked the look of the veterans in this box, even if the sergeant has a bit of a melty head!
There are some new Veterans coming out soon (end of October) so I'll be interested to see how they look as well!